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Thread: Newbie, Can you clear coat over single stage paint?

  1. #1
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    Default Newbie, Can you clear coat over single stage paint?

    Hi all,

    I am in the middle of painting my first petrol tank for a custom mini chopper I am building with a friend in work.

    Progress on the bike so far

    The first attempt at painting the tank didn't go to well with the paint reacting to the clear coat, so it has been sanded down ready for another try.

    The tank had been primed, and had a couple of coats of white paint a few months ago. Last week a black base coat was applied and then a flame pattern masked out, the first color on top of the black was red and then orange on top of that. The black had around a day to dry out but the red and orange where sprayed within a few hours of each other. After a day of curing I wanted to clear coat the tank to cover the ridge between the base coat and the pattern, straight away the orange began to crack where it blended with the red and looked like the bottom of a dry lake :mad:

    All the paint used was single stage paint, so my question is can you clear coat over single stage paint?

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated

    Pic before clear coat:


  2. #2

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    You can but in this case BC/CC would be the better choice, im pretty sure the blend areas in the flame licks didnt melt together potentially causing your problem. Personally, i dont think single stage is the rite medium here, BC/CC is the way to go. Since the tank is small i would strip to metal and start fresh with appropriate primers etc. I think you'll like the results much better.

    HTH

    Paul

  3. #3
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    That's what I was thinking, I have already stripped most of the tank back to bare metal. The front has just had a good rub down, not to metal as has been built up with filler and sanded after the tank was made.

  4. #4
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    Actually a lot of showcar guys paint clear over a single-stage paint, it lays flatter and shows better gloss I guess. However, it must be the same family (type) of paint. You don't want to lay a Urethane clear over Acrylic Enamel or something, but I have seen some Jobbers recommend doing just that...
    Is it really a Urethane Single Stage?? If so, have at it!

  5. #5
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    I clear over single stage quite a bit when I'm striping a car. I'll usually shoot the stripe color in single stage then sand that color and mask off my stripe and shoot the rest of the car in bc/cc, remove the stripe mask and spray the entire vehicle with clear.

    I would usually like to see most classic vehicles in single stage because of the extra gloss that clear can give some colors. When you apply clear it can make the car look a little non-stock.

  6. #6
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    Just sprayed a sample yesterday to eliminate the possibility of something being wrong with the way the tank was prepped, it turned out the same way. The red is fine but the orange ends up looking like the picture below:





    The clear coat is acrylic and I know the red is acrylic, but the orange was mixed by the shop I bought everything from, could the orange be urethane?

    The mix for the orange was 2 parts paint to 1 part hardener, plus 1 10th thinner, I told the monkey behind the counter that I would be clearing over the orange and he seemed ok with that. Anyhow Im going to take the sample down there tommorrow for them to look at.

  7. #7
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    Took the paint and the sample down to the guy I bought it from today, he recons the problem was with the paint being single stage and not requiring clear coat. I'll start painting again tommorrow, if all works out well I post some pics in a few days.

  8. #8
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    Finally got the tank finished after lots of hard work, had to rub it down a couple of times to get the paint to take. Seems like the orginal single stage I was given was not compatable with the 2 stage bc/cc. Not perfect but for my first tank I am made up with it. Thanks for the comments and advise, I keep reading your posts for further tips, still got the frame and rear fender to paint.

    After 4 Coats of clear and color sanded:



    Finished job with 2 more coats of clear after sanding:


  9. #9
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    Looks pretty good. Are you going to strugle with the rest, or just go BC/CC next time? Don't know why someone would use SS as a base coat.

  10. #10
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    Thanks, All the paint is now BC/CC, so hopefully no strugling for a good finish. The only reason I had SS was because I took a spray can of the color I wanted to the paint shop and asked for the same color in BC, but the guy gave me the exact same thing as the can, which was SS.

  11. #11

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    If it is anything like One Shot striping enamel then you have to add hardner to the paint if you want to clear it. some guys add the same hardner that they will use for the clear to make it work together. Just what i have heard.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by zingercustoms
    If it is anything like One Shot striping enamel then you have to add hardner to the paint if you want to clear it. some guys add the same hardner that they will use for the clear to make it work together. Just what i have heard.
    If the orange is enamel you could have problems depending on the characteristics of the color or the clear. Since a bad reaction is shown on the test panel you may want to get another clear to test but if you still have problems you may need to find another color and re-paint the tank.
    You could also be having problems if you're trying to clear coat an enamel too soon after it's application. Keep it warm for a couple days before you apply clear.

  13. #13
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    Thanks for the help, I took the orginal orange SS back to the shop and they swapped it for a BC of a similar color. So the problem has gone away, while painting I kept trying the paints on a test sheet before using them on the tank.

  14. #14
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    Fender has now been painted along with some other bits and pieces. Hopefully i'll be ready to put everything together next week. Just need to finish welding and paint the frame also re-paint the engine.

    Full set of pics: http://s110.photobucket.com/albums/n...per/?start=all








  15. #15
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    Is it possible you are confusing single part and single stage? It sounds like your first attempt was with lacquer or enamel from a spray can. Is that right? Either of them would be described as single part paint, not to be confused with single stage which is paint that is mixed with a hardener and then applied.

    Bob K

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