TheCoatingStore.com

Results 1 to 14 of 14

Thread: Large van respray - slower activator - cold shop?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2021
    Posts
    6

    Smile Large van respray - slower activator - cold shop?

    Welcome everyone,

    I'm brand new to the forum and brand new to painting with 2pack paint.

    I'm in the middle of quite a big project, of respraying a VW Crafter Long Wheel Base, as it's being converting into a camper van. I have done a bit of spraying before, things I made - trailers, gates etc. - but never a vehicle.

    Always wanted to try my hand at a full vehicle respray, but just never had the opportunity with working away from home. Now, I'm doing a van conversion it was the perfect opportunity to take on something way to much for me

    I have been rubbing the van down for 4 months - in between working full time, and I have already got some paint on the van. See the pictures below.

    The doors and bonnet are all off on tressells and painted - they turned out quite good for my first attempt and i'm reasonably happy - nothing some wet and dry and a good machine polish can't fix.

    However, I'm looking for some advice on how to tackle the van body. At the moment I have it split masked down the middle, and planned on spraying half and half. Only trouble is, the temperature has dropped quite dramatically here in Northern Ireland the past week, and is set for approx 13 Celcius (55 Fahrenheit) by the time I get to spray the body of the van.

    I painted the bottom part of the van black at the weekend, and found that by the time I got around with the second coat, the first had already flashed too quickly and it led to a couple of runs which I couldn't see. It was a deep black RAL 9005. Note, This was with a medium rate hardener at 2:1 with 10% medium reducer

    I'm thinking now, that one half of the van is quite a large area to spray, and by the time I get around to my second coat of brown, the first will have flashed hard already. So, should I use a slow activator, in order to keep my paint flowable and wet for longer? It will be approx 55 Fahrenheit in the workshop - will this affect things?

    There is two large diesel space heaters, but I'm sort of reluctant to use them as I have read online about them pumping out a layer of carbon onto the panels or something and potentially contaminating the surface.

    It's coming into fall (autumn) now in Ireland.

    Please note my workshop is in a very rural remote part of Ireland, and although I don't have a spray booth, I have a large workshop which is quite cold. My nearest neighbour is probably 1 mile from me.

    I've been using a full air fed mask, with 3 stage coalescing filter.

    I want to get painting this weekend, my paint shop provided me with medium and extra fast activator back in the summer months, but now I'm only actually getting around to the job in very cold conditions, I can take the extra fast back and swap it for whatever is needed.

    What do you reckon is the best route to tackle this large van, with poorish ventilation and a cold 55 F workshop.

    Thanks for your comments,
    Gareth.


    IMG_20211019_202856.jpgIMG_20211019_193605.jpgIMG_20211017_194309.jpgIMG_20210926_083122.jpgIMG_20210926_083307.jpg
    Last edited by Gareth-w; 10-21-2021 at 04:06 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    45,506

    Default

    Welcome aboard Gareth-w

    When the temperature is cold it normally pays to use a "fast hardener and reducer". It appears that you're doing an excellent job and I would recommend breaking up the remaining painting into sections if possible so that you don't have a lot of variables to handle all at once.

    Apply your first coat and allow it to dry to the light touch before applying your second coat and that will help stop the runs.

    Be sure that each section that you paint is lit well so that you can see the result of your spraying as you spray.

    Low temperatures allows the paint to flow more so don't apply it too heavily. It's easier to sand and polish out orange peel than trying to remove runs.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2021
    Posts
    6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Len View Post
    Welcome aboard Gareth-w

    When the temperature is cold it normally pays to use a "fast hardener and reducer". It appears that you're doing an excellent job and I would recommend breaking up the remaining painting into sections if possible so that you don't have a lot of variables to handle all at once.

    Apply your first coat and allow it to dry to the light touch before applying your second coat and that will help stop the runs.

    Be sure that each section that you paint is lit well so that you can see the result of your spraying as you spray.

    Low temperatures allows the paint to flow more so don't apply it too heavily. It's easier to sand and polish out orange peel than trying to remove runs.
    Hi Len,

    Thank you for the advice.

    Do you think If I was to go ahead and spray the van as it is - split down the middle, including one half of the roof - using a medium rate activator and reducer - that I could paint the roof first, two coats, then work my way from front to back. Just spraying it in smaller sections that I think I can keep the previous coat flashed and tacky.

    Or would overspray then be the problem for my parts where I have applied two/three light coats?

    Just trying to think of as many options here which can get the job done over the weekend.

    Great forum you all have here, invaluable source of information for somebody like myself who is learning a new skill

    Regards,
    Gareth.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    45,506

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gareth-w View Post
    Hi Len,

    Thank you for the advice.

    Do you think If I was to go ahead and spray the van as it is - split down the middle, including one half of the roof - using a medium rate activator and reducer - that I could paint the roof first, two coats, then work my way from front to back. Just spraying it in smaller sections that I think I can keep the previous coat flashed and tacky.

    Or would overspray then be the problem for my parts where I have applied two/three light coats?

    Just trying to think of as many options here which can get the job done over the weekend.

    Great forum you all have here, invaluable source of information for somebody like myself who is learning a new skill

    Regards,
    Gareth.
    When we paint vans and trucks we almost always paint the roof first then mask it off the next day and continue painting the rest of the vehicle. That way we're not climbing over wet paint to get to the roof.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    olympia,wa
    Posts
    1,750

    Default

    if you mask one half of the roof down the middle you'll have a hard line to deal with. if you leave it all exposed and only paint half there'll be overspray. i'd set up some scaffolding down both sides and paint it all in one session. the nice thing about the roof is that it's up high, out of sight. if there's a flaw you'll never see it.
    the hard part in my opinion, is finding the right place to mask so you can do the front section of the roof. (above the windshield) it's not clear to me if there's a good place to tape it off while you do the rest of the roof, or if you'll have to lump it in with the rest.
    maybe if you start at the rear, one side, work your way to the front. then cross to the other side and work front to back. then that front section will easily still be wet when you cross sides.
    the temperature is a little concerning, urethane likes to be above 60-65 f to cure properly.
    when doing big stuff like that i've used those construction heaters with good success. the kind that sits outside and just has a big hot air hose that runs inside the building/ enclosure. they tend to stir up dust though, so diffusing the output is a good idea.
    b marler

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2021
    Posts
    6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmarler View Post
    if you mask one half of the roof down the middle you'll have a hard line to deal with. if you leave it all exposed and only paint half there'll be overspray. i'd set up some scaffolding down both sides and paint it all in one session. the nice thing about the roof is that it's up high, out of sight. if there's a flaw you'll never see it.
    the hard part in my opinion, is finding the right place to mask so you can do the front section of the roof. (above the windshield) it's not clear to me if there's a good place to tape it off while you do the rest of the roof, or if you'll have to lump it in with the rest.
    maybe if you start at the rear, one side, work your way to the front. then cross to the other side and work front to back. then that front section will easily still be wet when you cross sides.
    the temperature is a little concerning, urethane likes to be above 60-65 f to cure properly.
    when doing big stuff like that i've used those construction heaters with good success. the kind that sits outside and just has a big hot air hose that runs inside the building/ enclosure. they tend to stir up dust though, so diffusing the output is a good idea.
    Hi bmarler,

    I forgot to mention, although I have it split down the middle, at both the front and back of the van, I have masked on across up top (where it won't be seen) to the lip running up the same line as the side of the windscreen - in order to not have a hard line running up the middle. That way my two joints in the paint will be hidden.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but, If the paint has flashed quick, and is no longer at the 'tacky' state - Is it still ok to proceed to apply another coat of paint - all be it lighter coats to avoid runs?

    Regards,
    Gareth.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    olympia,wa
    Posts
    1,750

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gareth-w View Post
    Hi bmarler,

    I forgot to mention, although I have it split down the middle, at both the front and back of the van, I have masked on across up top (where it won't be seen) to the lip running up the same line as the side of the windscreen - in order to not have a hard line running up the middle. That way my two joints in the paint will be hidden.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but, If the paint has flashed quick, and is no longer at the 'tacky' state - Is it still ok to proceed to apply another coat of paint - all be it lighter coats to avoid runs?

    Regards,
    Gareth.
    it takes a while for the paint to set so hard that the next coat won't melt in. i don't think you'll have that problem. you actually want it to flash pretty well before applying the next coat. i will run the back of my finger along the masking right next to the panel you're painting to judge when to start the next coat. when you can brush your finger along the surface and it doesn't "grab" it's time to go.
    sometimes on big stuff (i've done a few boats in the 30 -35 foot range) i can shoot continuously as it flashes by the time i get around it. i use a two quart pressure pot for stuff like that so i don't have to stop and reload the gun very often.
    b marler

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    olympia,wa
    Posts
    1,750

    Default

    i should also mention, the second and third coats should be at least medium wet. don't go so light that you make dry spray or too much orange peel. watch the paint hit the panel so you make sure it's laying out nice and smooth. it's a good idea to have a test panel next to your project so you can see how it's going to go before you hit the real thing.
    b marler

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2021
    Posts
    6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmarler View Post
    it takes a while for the paint to set so hard that the next coat won't melt in. i don't think you'll have that problem. you actually want it to flash pretty well before applying the next coat. i will run the back of my finger along the masking right next to the panel you're painting to judge when to start the next coat. when you can brush your finger along the surface and it doesn't "grab" it's time to go.
    sometimes on big stuff (i've done a few boats in the 30 -35 foot range) i can shoot continuously as it flashes by the time i get around it. i use a two quart pressure pot for stuff like that so i don't have to stop and reload the gun very often.
    Thank you for the back of finger trick, I shall use that. Great advice, I think by the time I get around to my second coat, the previous will be ready for round 2 as well.

    A larger pot would be handy!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2021
    Posts
    6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmarler View Post
    i should also mention, the second and third coats should be at least medium wet. don't go so light that you make dry spray or too much orange peel. watch the paint hit the panel so you make sure it's laying out nice and smooth. it's a good idea to have a test panel next to your project so you can see how it's going to go before you hit the real thing.
    Just another question for you, I have fitted fibreglass flares to the side of the van, for extra sideways sleeping space. I have flattened down the gloss coat of them with 400grit and got a nice smooth surface. Will I be ok to apply my 2pack directly on to this fibreglass surface. I did look this up before getting to this stage and my conclusion was yes it's fine without a plastic primer.

    Thanks.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    olympia,wa
    Posts
    1,750

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gareth-w View Post
    Just another question for you, I have fitted fibreglass flares to the side of the van, for extra sideways sleeping space. I have flattened down the gloss coat of them with 400grit and got a nice smooth surface. Will I be ok to apply my 2pack directly on to this fibreglass surface. I did look this up before getting to this stage and my conclusion was yes it's fine without a plastic primer.

    Thanks.
    are they fiberglass or plastic? if they're plastic like bumper covers you should use adhesion promoter. if they're fiberglass, i always use epoxy before paint. an epoxy sealer will be a good choice there. are these the bump outs i saw on the pictures? not wheel arch flares?
    some painters will shoot paint over previously painted, or other surfaces (like gel coat)without any coating in between. i'm not one of those painters. i will at the very least use a sealer before top coats.
    b marler

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2021
    Posts
    6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmarler View Post
    are they fiberglass or plastic? if they're plastic like bumper covers you should use adhesion promoter. if they're fiberglass, i always use epoxy before paint. an epoxy sealer will be a good choice there. are these the bump outs i saw on the pictures? not wheel arch flares?
    some painters will shoot paint over previously painted, or other surfaces (like gel coat)without any coating in between. i'm not one of those painters. i will at the very least use a sealer before top coats.
    Yes these fibreglass pop outs are known as flares in the Campervan scene.

    I have a good surface sanded down to 400g. I was thinking a primer shouldn't be required.

    IMG_20211011_203358.jpgIMG_20211019_202737.jpg

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    olympia,wa
    Posts
    1,750

    Default

    primer may not be required for the paint to look good right now, but down the road it may start to show as easy chipping, or worse, coming off in large chunks. like i said, there are painters that do it, i'm not one of them.
    when fiberglass pieces are made, there a mold wax to allow the part to be released from the mold. hopefully you washed and degreased these parts well before doing any sanding. it's possible to drive the release agent down into the surface and cause problems like fisheye if you just start sanding them as delivered.
    gel coat is also slightly porous, so it can be tough to get all the contaminates out. epoxy is a little more forgiving than paint at dealing with slight surface contamination. plus, if the epoxy shows any problems, you can deal with them before applying paint. some epoxy sealers can be top coated very quickly, urethane sealers only need to flash. it's just another coat to apply.
    you can certainly try to shoot without any seal coat, i'm just telling you what i would do.
    b marler

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    olympia,wa
    Posts
    1,750

    Default

    just thinking, i don't know how these flares were prepared as delivered. if they had some sort of primer on them, like when you buy a fender with e-coat on it, more primer may not be required. if the finish holds up to the lacquer thinner wipe anyway.
    b marler

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •