Collision Repair Advice.

[SStampede]

I will be looking for a new D/D project soon for the wifey. I do have some experience with "body work", just by watching and helping my friends. But now I'm on my own, so I call myself a Newbie. I would like some advice on how to repair this vehicle. I liked that the damage missed the frame rails, but is close to the shock tower. The repair would not have to be perfect, but I don't want to be able to till that is has been hit. I've seen alot of hacks over the years, I would rather do most of the work myself. And farm out what I cant.
So, after the car was pulled, what is the best way to repair the upper rail?

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[Len]

I will be looking for a new D/D project soon for the wifey. I do have some experience with "body work", just by watching and helping my friends. But now I'm on my own, so I call myself a Newbie. I would like some advice on how to repair this vehicle. I liked that the damage missed the frame rails, but is close to the shock tower. The repair would not have to be perfect, but I don't want to be able to till that is has been hit. I've seen alot of hacks over the years, I would rather do most of the work myself. And farm out what I cant.
So, after the car was pulled, what is the best way to repair the upper rail?

Thanks.829_001.jpg830_001.jpg

The first thing I would do is to make a list while taking it apart then look for used, aftermarket or new parts. Finding a junk car would be best but most junkers are also hit in the front. You may end up sectioning the inner fender and replacing the radiator support so it would be good to start with those parts. You'll need to make sure that new inner sheet metal is aligned properly before welding so that the remaining reassembly bolts and aligns properly. By the looks of the damage you could have more in parts than you paid for the car.

[SStampede]

I'm more interested in the damage, what to look for, any hidden surprises I'm not seeing. To me it looks mainly cosmetic, hood, fenders, bumper, bumper cover head lights, rad. cond. rad core, head light panel, paint all the costly things. They are asking 15'900 for it, its a2011 mustang gt vert. It's not what I want, but I've seen some others hit similar to it.

[Phil V]

I'm more interested in the damage, what to look for, any hidden surprises I'm not seeing. To me it looks mainly cosmetic, hood, fenders, bumper, bumper cover head lights, rad. cond. rad core, head light panel, paint all the costly things. They are asking 15'900 for it, its a2011 mustang gt vert. It's not what I want, but I've seen some others hit similar to it.

Is that a salvage title vehicle ? A totalled out write off from the insurance company ?

[Kalamity]

look for a front clip with the cage, you need the rad support the apron and the outher clothing... as Len said. Then you return the left over part for a micro-refund from the junk yard. You will need some frame re-rack facilities to work on the car. but it is an easy one as you have no bondo, but you need to put it straight (one of your framerail is higher than the other, and the shocktower might have moved)
If you dont have the tools, dont touch!
but first ting fist, the price of parts$$$$$

[SStampede]

Yes it's a salvage title car. So what you are saying it's not a good idea to have the car pulled, then I do the rest? As for the price of the parts, yes on this car they will be high, but I'm not worried about that. Based on, I'm more concerned with the damage, I will be searching for an 06-08 mustang, making the parts cheaper.

Thanks.

[Phil V]

Yes it's a salvage title car. So what you are saying it's not a good idea to have the car pulled, then I do the rest? As for the price of the parts, yes on this car they will be high, but I'm not worried about that. Based on, I'm more concerned with the damage, I will be searching for an 06-08 mustang, making the parts cheaper.

Thanks.

I have been repairing wrecked repairables for several decades and to me a salvage title is a big red flag. Unless you plan on turning this thing into an all out drag car that will only be driven at the drag strip then my advice is to steer clear of any cars with a salvage title. Has it also occured to you that the reason the car has a salvage title is because - COST OF REPAIRS EXCEED THE VALUE OF THE VEHICLE ? That's with a reputable professional quality minded body shop correctly repairing the car to pre-accident condition. The repairs would cost more than the car is worth. Of course an person with little or no experience sees that car as a golden opportunity to get a newer car finished up and ready to go for about half of what a comparable car is worth. In reality what usually happens is the inexperienced person buys a wrecked salvage titled vehicle and get in way over his head. It ends up costing him more than the car is worth. People get in over their head and they already have a considerable amount of money invested and when they find out how much money its really going to take to finish the car up its already too late for them to back out and recoup their invested money. So they keep pouring money into the project just to get it finished up. They see comparable UNWRECKED clear title cars selling for X amount of dollars and they think they salvage/repaired vehicle is going to be worth that same amount of money as a clear title never wrecked car. The truth is a newer salvage repaired vehicle is worth about 1/3 less than a clear title car. Buy a car already done with a clear title or a car that was never wrecked, you will be money ahead in the short term and the long term. This applies in most cases to cars less than 5 years old, its iffy in cars around 5 to ten years old and cars older than 10 years old that need a little work can be a good deal financially and to just to keep and drive the vehicle.

Think about it for a minute -- I have all the tools, equipment, knowledge and expertise to repair salvage title vehicle and I avoid them like the plague.
That should tell you something.

[Budulater]

I have been repairing wrecked repairables for several decades and to me a salvage title is a big red flag. Unless you plan on turning this thing into an all out drag car that will only be driven at the drag strip then my advice is to steer clear of any cars with a salvage title. Has it also occured to you that the reason the car has a salvage title is because - COST OF REPAIRS EXCEED THE VALUE OF THE VEHICLE ? That's with a reputable professional quality minded body shop correctly repairing the car to pre-accident condition. The repairs would cost more than the car is worth. Of course an person with little or no experience sees that car as a golden opportunity to get a newer car finished up and ready to go for about half of what a comparable car is worth. In reality what usually happens is the inexperienced person buys a wrecked salvage titled vehicle and get in way over his head. It ends up costing him more than the car is worth. People get in over their head and they already have a considerable amount of money invested and when they find out how much money its really going to take to finish the car up its already too late for them to back out and recoup their invested money. So they keep pouring money into the project just to get it finished up. They see comparable UNWRECKED clear title cars selling for X amount of dollars and they think they salvage/repaired vehicle is going to be worth that same amount of money as a clear title never wrecked car. The truth is a newer salvage repaired vehicle is worth about 1/3 less than a clear title car. Buy a car already done with a clear title or a car that was never wrecked, you will be money ahead in the short term and the long term. This applies in most cases to cars less than 5 years old, its iffy in cars around 5 to ten years old and cars older than 10 years old that need a little work can be a good deal financially and to just to keep and drive the vehicle.

Think about it for a minute -- I have all the tools, equipment, knowledge and expertise to repair salvage title vehicle and I avoid them like the plague.
That should tell you something.

I pretty much agree Phil.There are exceptions,But if you have limited experience in dealing with these types of repairs,it can get you into a bit of trouble.I steer clear of salvage repairs also.It takes pretty good money to total a car this new.

JMO after 30 + years

[Phil V]

I pretty much agree Phil.There are exceptions,But if you have limited experience in dealing with these types of repairs,it can get you into a bit of trouble.I steer clear of salvage repairs also.It takes pretty good money to total a car this new.

JMO after 30 + years

Budulater, I fully agree that there ARE exceptions and that some rare good deals out there. BUT it takes someone like you or me or any of the other well experienced bodymen here to know which ones to stay away from and which rare one is worth buying and fixing up.

[SStampede]

Mr. Phil V, I understand what you are telling me. But I'm a little surprised that you stay clear of salvage title vehicles with your experience. I bought an 03 4x4 QC in June of 04, I had about 16,500 in it.

What do you think of this one? If I could get it for 5,900 I would buy.

Thanks.

[Bob K]

Two weeks ago I made a 600 mile trip to get a Lucerne that had what looked like minimal damage to the sides. Needed front bumper head lights, both fenders and 4 door skins and a little work on the rockers. I’ve been fooled by photos before so I took my car on this inspection trip instead of my truck and trailer. I saved $200 on gas but that would have worked against me if I bought the car because it would have to be two trips.

Well when I got there I was looking the car over and saw some dents in the roof that didn’t show up in the photos. It seems the car squeezed between two obstructions and went air born before it landed on its wheels in the ditch. The owner picked it up with a fork lift and I could see all the dents and ripped up stuff on the bottom, not to mention that the suspension was smashed solid on two wheels. The chrome premium wheels still looked great although they were deformed from impact with the ground. The roof dents were from the shock wave that went through the car when it landed.

Needles to say I am still looking for a car to do. There is a lot to inspect that doesn’t show up in photos and even though you can’t see the damage it still needs to be fixed.

Bob K

[autobodytech43]

Mr. Phil V, I understand what you are telling me. But I'm a little surprised that you stay clear of salvage title vehicles with your experience. I bought an 03 4x4 QC in June of 04, I had about 16,500 in it.

What do you think of this one? If I could get it for 5,900 I would buy.

Thanks.

Tally up all the parts and materials you need or assume you'd need and figure what you can save. If you can paint and have done this before I'd get this cause it'd be easy to estimate the cost to fix this with just taking off a few parts. I'm currently looking for a Prius with front end damage like this. If you can do the repair the cost of repair doesn't matter to me cause it's just paying with my own time and work. It's not like I get paid $100 an hour to sit around on the weekend. Guys who look for salvage cars look for cars that they personally like or high value cars with front end damage or minimal rear end damage, but mainly front end damage cause with those two you can fix a lot without a frame rack. You
don't really want to mess with anything that affects pillars...just not worth it to me, and if you get one with front end damage check the suspension and shock towers. If it can't pass alignment it's not worth it.

bottom line, if you haven't done this before you might not know what you're getting into and I highly recommend against it.

[SStampede]

BobK, that's what I'm afraid of happening, just looking for advice so I don't over look something, the past or the only two vehicles I have done. I bought them from looking at the pics, and then having them shipped to me.

Autobodytech43, your statement is 100% correct, that what I look for. I did an 01 Avalon that was hit in the front.

Thanks.

[SamG]

One thing to be careful of when looking for damaged cars is to not be fooled by a seller that does some pulls to make the car look like the damage is much less than it actually is.

For example in the first set of pictures, I can see the damaged radiator and A/C condenser, however the radiator support isn't wrapped around them, which tells me that more than likely the car has had AT LEAST a light pull performed. It could have been done by a repair shop just to make sure to write a comprehensive estimate, but that is something to look out for.

SamG

[Phil V]

BobK, that's what I'm afraid of happening, just looking for advice so I don't over look something, the past or the only two vehicles I have done. I bought them from looking at the pics, and then having them shipped to me.

Autobodytech43, your statement is 100% correct, that what I look for. I did an 01 Avalon that was hit in the front.

Thanks.

IF I were to buy a salvage title wrecked vehicle (which in most cases I wouldn't) I would much rather buy a light roll over, a side hit or a rear hit before I buy a car that was totalled out from a front end hit. All the serious money parts are in the front of a car -- frame rails, cowl, transmission, engine, front cradle, front suspension, fender aprons, door hinge posts electronics etc etc. A side hit can be more labor intensive but its cheaper, faster and easier to repair than a serious front end hit. The same goes for a rear end hit, it can be labor intensive but in most cases a lot cheaper to repair than a front end hit. A light roll over is a gravy job as far as I'm concerned. It usually involves just sheet metal repair with little or no suspension or structural damage.

I have seen many times where a front end hit involves crushing one of the front axles into the transmission cracking the bell housing on the trans. Almost impossible to see until the car has all the damaged parts removed. Trans is junk and a minimum of two to three grand to replace. I would NEVER buy a wrecked car (especially a salvage title car) going by just a couple pictures posted on the internet or autoswapper mags etc. There is just about ALWAYS hidden damage that can only be assessed by a professional bodyman who inspects the car in person at the site where the car is. Even then you can get screwed because of hidden damage that is hidden until the car has been dismantled for repair.

My '07 Mustang Shelby had been in an accident before I bought the car. The salesman at the Ford dealer told me right up front that the car had been in an accident. My first question was " does it have a salvage title ?" and was informed that it has a regular clear title. I REALLY liked the car and inspected it as close as I could there on the dealer lot. The people that did the work on the car did an excellent job of repairing it. I could not find any tell tale signs of repairs. I told them I needed to see the car up on a vehicle lift where I could inspect the bottom side of the car. Again, NO tell tale signs of repair (and I DO know what to look for and where to look). I then told them I wanted to see pictures of the damage BEFORE the car was repaired so I could gauge the extent of the damage before it was repaired. The salesman put me in touch with the previous owner who put me in touch with the shop that did the repair work on the car. The bodyshop emailed me detailed pictures of the damage before and during the repair work they did along with a detailed copy of the original estimate to repair the car. Those people did an exceptional level of quality work on that car and they told me I had a lifetime warranty on the work they did on the car. I bought the car for what I and the dealer both thought was a reasonable price and I am VERY happy with the purchase and the car in general. Needless to say its in hibernation for the winter in the garage addition I built especially for that car.