TheCoatingStore.com

Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Temperature and Scratch for Epoxy Primer

  1. #1

    Default Temperature and Scratch for Epoxy Primer

    I live in Las Vegas and it's going to be hovering in the 106* range for the foreseeable future. The shop is between 85-90* before noon and after that it stays around 95* till sunset. The car is a combination of bare metal and filler that is sanded down to 80 grit. I'm shooting PPG DP50LF with DP402LF catalyst. Is this a safe temperature range to shoot in? Since I'm shooting Slick Sand over the epoxy the 80 grit scratch should be fine, right? After I shoot the epoxy, what scratch should I put in it to get the best adhesion with the Slick Sand?

    Thanks, Guys!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    1,610

    Default

    Why do you want to put epoxy down first? You can view the Slick Sand product sheet here http://www.evercoat.com/imgs/pis/SLICKSANDPIS.pdf .
    They donít say anything about using epoxy. You may be able to use the instruction for pre painted surfaces.

    Bob K

  3. #3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob K View Post
    Why do you want to put epoxy down first? You can view the Slick Sand product sheet here http://www.evercoat.com/imgs/pis/SLICKSANDPIS.pdf .
    They donít say anything about using epoxy. You may be able to use the instruction for pre painted surfaces.

    Bob K
    I've read the sheet and many posts about Slick Sand over metal/filler or over epoxy. The car I'm painting is completely stripped, frame and all and I've decided to shoot the entire thing in epoxy, SS, sealer, then bc/cc. Given that recipe, does anyone have any knowledge of safe spraying temperatures regarding heat? I read back through the p-sheet and posts to find the scratch info, but nothing about temp, which is my main concern.

    Thanks!

  4. #4

    Default

    I know it says it sticks to bare metal on the PIS sheet, but it also says this directly below the substrates info,

    "NOTE: All bare metal areas larger than one inch in diameter must be treated with a high quality self-etch or epoxy primer"

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    27,971

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by shrunken66stroker View Post
    I know it says it sticks to bare metal on the PIS sheet, but it also says this directly below the substrates info,

    "NOTE: All bare metal areas larger than one inch in diameter must be treated with a high quality self-etch or epoxy primer"
    Actually there are Evercoat documents that say no epoxy needed and there are Evercoat documents that say to apply epoxy primer under Slick Sand. I would apply epoxy, scuff it then apply the SS. Yes, 80 grit would be fine.

    I've done this without epoxy and the SS seemed to work fine but after I read that epoxy primer should be applied I always used it.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    191

    Default

    Len, I know you don't use PPG, so you wouldn't know that they say not to sand DP primers before top coating. Except if it is out of the recoat window, then scuff and recoat with more DP epoxy before topcoating.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,092

    Default

    Las Vegas, hell that's the artic circle dude. Phoenix, where I live, is at least 5 degrees hotter. With epoxy primer heat is your friend. I'd mix as directed and then use the slowest available urethane grade reducer at about 10% to enhance the flow out.

    Epoxy primer/sealer is unique. It takes at least 72 hours typically to reach full cure. After that the only thing that sticks to it after scuffing is itself. This is the meaning of the recoat window. If you shoot the epoxy and then come in with the slick sand within the recoat window you'll be fine and will need to do absolutely no scuffing whatsoever. If you shoot the epoxy, wait a week then you have to scuff (Red Scotchbrite) and reshoot with epoxy to get the recoat window active again and then come in with the Slick Sand. At no time do you sand the epoxy unless your out of the recoat window and intend to respray epoxy.

    Epoxy primer is unique chemistry very unlike urethane and lacquer chemistry.

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis N. Schmidt View Post
    Las Vegas, hell that's the artic circle dude. Phoenix, where I live, is at least 5 degrees hotter. With epoxy primer heat is your friend. I'd mix as directed and then use the slowest available urethane grade reducer at about 10% to enhance the flow out.

    Epoxy primer/sealer is unique. It takes at least 72 hours typically to reach full cure. After that the only thing that sticks to it after scuffing is itself. This is the meaning of the recoat window. If you shoot the epoxy and then come in with the slick sand within the recoat window you'll be fine and will need to do absolutely no scuffing whatsoever. If you shoot the epoxy, wait a week then you have to scuff (Red Scotchbrite) and reshoot with epoxy to get the recoat window active again and then come in with the Slick Sand. At no time do you sand the epoxy unless your out of the recoat window and intend to respray epoxy.

    Epoxy primer is unique chemistry very unlike urethane and lacquer chemistry.
    Ahh, Thank you Dennis! Exactly what I wanted to know. So, moving forward, how about temp for Deltron Bc/Cc? Do have any experience with that particular product? What brands do you use and how do you adjust, if at all, for the heat?
    And 113* is definitely not the Arctic Circle, but I do feel for you guys down there!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,092

    Default

    The key with the basecoat is the reducer. With DBC you mix the basecoat 1:1 with urethane grade reducer. Get the hottest temperature reducer your distributor carries. This will give you the open time you need to spray the stuff on to the car as a liquid without it going onto the car in the form of pre-dried powder which in the temperatures in which we both live can happen.

    With the clear you need the highest temperature activator you can get. Also adding 10% reducer having the highest temperature range you can get (you'll have some of this left over from the DBC) helps with the flow out and minimizes the orange peel.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,063

    Default

    You will need DT 895 reducer,you can either use it straight up or use one part DT885/one part DT 895 and mix them together.Be careful reuducing DPLF epoxies,no more than 25 percent is reccomended.Once you reduce it your film build is not as high so corrosion resistance is not optimum,PPG reccomends 2 coats.Also use DP 401 catalyst that requires a 30 min induction period,it will increase the corrosion protection and adhesion in the DPLF epoxies.Too bad the old DP's are no longer made,the new stuff is not as good,that is why ppg also says for optimum corrosion resistance to use over dx1791 wash primer.Here is the TDS,read the red writing on the bottom of pg 1
    http://www.custom-aerosol.com/pdf/PP...duct-sheet.pdf

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    110

    Default

    http://www.evercoat.com/imgs/pis/Sli...S%20032009.pdf

    this is the CORRECT tech sheet for slicksand. What has been posted above is an older version. They've since changed their language on priming over large areas of bare steel, to correspond with other "quality" poly primer systems.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    27,971

    Default


    Quote Originally Posted by jeremyb View Post
    http://www.evercoat.com/imgs/pis/Sli...S%20032009.pdf

    this is the CORRECT tech sheet for slicksand. What has been posted above is an older version. They've since changed their language on priming over large areas of bare steel, to correspond with other "quality" poly primer systems.
    Yes, that looks correct.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •