PDA

View Full Version : COLOR SAND


TheCoatingStore.com

mike111
04-20-2013, 04:31 PM
Starting on the color sanding. Seems to be a little trial/error which I guess is normal? It would seem that there is not a "one size fits all" answer to how to do it best. I think it may depend on the clearcoat and other things, right?
I am using the airadvantage and interface pad. starting with 1000, then 1500, 3000, and 4000. Next I tried the wool, then orange, and black. I seem to get the same or better results with just going from the 4000 to the black pad. Does this make any sense? Also there seems to be a correct speed and I've tried many and ended thinking slow was better and then faster at the end. Also, I used a little distilled water sprayed, then a little more. Seems to be better with a little. It looks like a mirror straight on..perfect as can be. When I look down the side, it still is very glossy, but seems a little rippled. This might just be how it's going to be. It is black/black base with SPI universal c/c. If anyone any input, I would appreciate it. Thanks so much.

Len
04-20-2013, 05:15 PM
Starting on the color sanding. Seems to be a little trial/error which I guess is normal? It would seem that there is not a "one size fits all" answer to how to do it best. I think it may depend on the clearcoat and other things, right?
I am using the airadvantage and interface pad. starting with 1000, then 1500, 3000, and 4000. Next I tried the wool, then orange, and black. I seem to get the same or better results with just going from the 4000 to the black pad. Does this make any sense? Also there seems to be a correct speed and I've tried many and ended thinking slow was better and then faster at the end. Also, I used a little distilled water sprayed, then a little more. Seems to be better with a little. It looks like a mirror straight on..perfect as can be. When I look down the side, it still is very glossy, but seems a little rippled. This might just be how it's going to be. It is black/black base with SPI universal c/c. If anyone any input, I would appreciate it. Thanks so much.

I usually run about half speed with the AirVantage and 1000 grit is pretty coarse unless you have some pretty rough paint, I usually start with 1500 then jump to 3000 then polish. After sanding with 3000 or 4000 the surface has a slight shine to it so it shouldn't take much polishing to make it perfect. If you have waves in the surface you may want to start by hand sanding with a hard block wrapped with some 1000 grit wet paper then jump to the finer stuff. Of course you need enough clear on the surface to do all this sanding.

mike111
04-20-2013, 05:35 PM
Thanks. I originally started with the 1500 but it was taking too long. So maybe it's rough. I was using full speed on the sander, not half. There is 4 coat on there, except the door jabs which have 2. It is about 1.5 gallons of sprayable material in clear. I think there is enough on there but I was worried about taking too much off.

Len
04-20-2013, 05:41 PM
Thanks. I originally started with the 1500 but it was taking too long. So maybe it's rough. I was using full speed on the sander, not half. There is 4 coat on there, except the door jabs which have 2. It is about 1.5 gallons of sprayable material in clear. I think there is enough on there but I was worried about taking too much off.

If you're wet sanding every stage you won't be able to see as you sand so it's best to use a rubber squeegee to wipe the surface as you sand so that you can check you're progress. Use the squeegee until you get a feel for the time and effort it takes to get the result you want before polishing.


http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/3m5517.jpg
LINK (http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ABS&Product_Code=3m5518c&Category_Code=PSH)

gtome
04-21-2013, 08:02 AM
If your sanding with 4000, I think a black wool pad would be a step backwards. I believe I would skip that step and move right to the foam.

Len
04-21-2013, 10:16 AM
If your sanding with 4000, I think a black wool pad would be a step backwards. I believe I would skip that step and move right to the foam.

I think he is talking about black foam which is very soft.

mike111
04-21-2013, 11:27 AM
If your sanding with 4000, I think a black wool pad would be a step backwards. I believe I would skip that step and move right to the foam.

It was the foam black pad that I got from Len. It is 1 step after the orange

mike111
04-21-2013, 07:14 PM
Update...I dont know. Henry....I would be interested in your input if you are reading. This seems to be your area of expertise. Anyone else too....I'm not picky. Not going as I would like. The 1500, 3000 ...orange, then black....I get a good gloss but in the direct sunlight I see very tiny little circle scratch. Like little DA sander. I can't tell for certain...but I think they are NOT below the c/c. I think they are in the clear. THis is because sometimes I mess with the buffer and pads and they are not there....then they are. I think the Mikita sander is a DA rotation but I'm not sure. I know the airadvantage is. The wipe off towel I use is a microfiber and even it leaves scratches. COULD the wizard polish I got from here be too much for this particular clearcoat. It is SPI and has been dry for a week. They tell be this is a clear that can be colorsanded a year from now and still be fine. Perhaps it is softer. I dont know.

Len
04-21-2013, 07:58 PM
Update...I dont know. Henry....I would be interested in your input if you are reading. This seems to be your area of expertise. Anyone else too....I'm not picky. Not going as I would like. The 1500, 3000 ...orange, then black....I get a good gloss but in the direct sunlight I see very tiny little circle scratch. Like little DA sander. I can't tell for certain...but I think they are NOT below the c/c. I think they are in the clear. THis is because sometimes I mess with the buffer and pads and they are not there....then they are. I think the Mikita sander is a DA rotation but I'm not sure. I know the airadvantage is. The wipe off towel I use is a microfiber and even it leaves scratches. COULD the wizard polish I got from here be too much for this particular clearcoat. It is SPI and has been dry for a week. They tell be this is a clear that can be colorsanded a year from now and still be fine. Perhaps it is softer. I dont know.

The Makita is a rotary not an orbital like the AirVantage. Swirls and scratches can come from a couple different things....
1. Any dust nibs in the paint that isn't leveled before buffing can lodge in the pad and cause swirls or scratches from either the sanding or the polishing.
2. If the clear is soft it can show swirls and scratches more than a hard clear.
3. Be sure to keep your sandpaper wet when using the AirVantage so that any particles will get washed away not not create problems.

The Mystic Cut won't create swirls even though it cuts pretty fast. We have people polishing high-end paint jobs with MC and are raving about it.

Robert
04-22-2013, 09:16 AM
When you're colorsanding you can get a nice shine without taking out the sandpaper scratch - shining the scratch. That's what it sounds like you're doing to me.

My typical practice is to sand down to a 3000 grit scratch -from whatever grit I start with through the finer and finer grits up to that - you know when you're there because when the shines up there is really nothing left. On the other hand, if you make a couple of passes with your polisher and then look at the paint and see deeper scratches, then you know you didn't cut deep enough after your initial cut.

It's a good idea to do one panel start to finish so you know exactly what is going to get the work really done.

I always start with a wool pad then go to the orange pad on the Makita BO6040 in forced rotation mode. Even then, I always have to go back over the whole car and look for misses, places where the scratch wasn't visible until all the haze left by sandpaper is completely gone.

Robert

Henry
04-22-2013, 10:27 AM
Update...I dont know. Henry....I would be interested in your input if you are reading. This seems to be your area of expertise. Anyone else too....I'm not picky. Not going as I would like. The 1500, 3000 ...orange, then black....I get a good gloss but in the direct sunlight I see very tiny little circle scratch. Like little DA sander. I can't tell for certain...but I think they are NOT below the c/c. I think they are in the clear. THis is because sometimes I mess with the buffer and pads and they are not there....then they are. I think the Mikita sander is a DA rotation but I'm not sure. I know the airadvantage is. The wipe off towel I use is a microfiber and even it leaves scratches. COULD the wizard polish I got from here be too much for this particular clearcoat. It is SPI and has been dry for a week. They tell be this is a clear that can be colorsanded a year from now and still be fine. Perhaps it is softer. I dont know.

Just saw this post and thanks for the comment. I'm certainly not an expert at colorsanding/buffing but I have put many hours in over the years to get it right. The EXPERT RESIDENT on this is ROBERT who posted to you in reply #10. Read what he said a few times until you can actually see what he is saying. Reply to him or send him a PM for better clarification.

I like to tell everybody when they start colorsanding/buffing NOT to look at the whole car but an 18 x 18 or 2 foot sqare area at a time. Take your time and keep your pads and paint surface clean. If you've used different products on the surface (also on the pads) I have found one could be fighting with the other and not allow the new compound to cut properly but rather glaze over what needs to be done.
If, IF, your initial cuts were not enough then that's another story.

You must be pretty special as you project brought Robert to post to you. I was about to send him a PM to ask where he's been as he's not posted here in several months.

ROBERT: counting on you to get Mike's project done (please).

Henry

mike111
04-22-2013, 07:42 PM
Thanks Robert, Len, and Henry. I am going to take this information and try another area on the car this week. I am wondering if perhaps I am using a worn out 3000 disc...so the scratch from the 1500 are still there. I'll replace all the discs and start in a new area and use plenty of water this time.
Just one last question, then I will take another stab at this...
I have a heck of a time with that wood pad. I "season" it as Robert does in one of the instructionals (somewhere on this site). I use the spur thing to run over it. I just gets all wacky when I put it on the car. Jumps and wont stay still. That's why I was using the Orange pad or black pad. Those are much much easier to control than the wool pad. If there any tips here, I'll take them. Thanks
Mike

Henry
04-23-2013, 10:09 AM
Thanks Robert, Len, and Henry. I am going to take this information and try another area on the car this week. I am wondering if perhaps I am using a worn out 3000 disc...so the scratch from the 1500 are still there. I'll replace all the discs and start in a new area and use plenty of water this time.
Just one last question, then I will take another stab at this...
I have a heck of a time with that wood pad. I "season" it as Robert does in one of the instructionals (somewhere on this site). I use the spur thing to run over it. I just gets all wacky when I put it on the car. Jumps and wont stay still. That's why I was using the Orange pad or black pad. Those are much much easier to control than the wool pad. If there any tips here, I'll take them. Thanks
Mike

This is one of those times I wish we all lived closer. What kind of buffer are you using and what position (like a clock) are you holding the buffer on the surface and what speed?
If you have a clean, unworn, uncontaminated wool pad, properly seasoned the pad should not cause jumping. IF you're holding the pad on the surface at 12 & 3 o'clock the pad should not start jumping. IF you're running the machine at a lower speed the pad should not start jumping. IF your buffer has the balls to handle the task and has a soft start the pad should not be jumping. Are you using a rotary buffer like a Makita 9227c? Finally, is there a chance you have any form of a silicone contaminant on your painted surface or was the pad ever used with a silicone type product which the compound is breaking loose and causing you problems?

I think you might be buffing at too high a speed and maybe not making contact at the desirable 12 & 3. What say you?

Henry

mike111
04-23-2013, 06:07 PM
Thanks Henry. I had not thought about how I hold it. I will try the 12 & 3 position you mention. Yes, the 9227 Makita...that's the one I have. The wood pad is new. Yes, possibly too high of a speed and certainly not paying attention to the position. Pad should be flat on surface, right?

Len
04-23-2013, 08:17 PM
Thanks Henry. I had not thought about how I hold it. I will try the 12 & 3 position you mention. Yes, the 9227 Makita...that's the one I have. The wood pad is new. Yes, possibly too high of a speed and certainly not paying attention to the position. Pad should be flat on surface, right?

No the machine is tilted slightly so that the pad is only touching on one side and depending on which direction you want the rotation it's usually between 9 and 12 or between 12 and 3. If you lay the pad flat it will tend to jump around. Start with a slow rotation around 1000 RPM or less until you get the feel for it then you can speed up if you want. After sanding I usually start around 1000 RPM with more pressure then, as the surface gets smooth, I increase my speed and apply less pressure.


http://i1021.photobucket.com/albums/af333/AutoBodyStore/Posts/clock1_zps286f9d8f.jpg

mike111
04-26-2013, 09:57 PM
No the machine is tilted slightly so that the pad is only touching on one side and depending on which direction you want the rotation it's usually between 9 and 12 or between 12 and 3. If you lay the pad flat it will tend to jump around. Start with a slow rotation around 1000 RPM or less until you get the feel for it then you can speed up if you want. After sanding I usually start around 1000 RPM with more pressure then, as the surface gets smooth, I increase my speed and apply less pressure.


http://i1021.photobucket.com/albums/af333/AutoBodyStore/Posts/clock1_zps286f9d8f.jpg

Oh, now it is clear. I tried that tonight. Worked much better. Going to take a good luck at it in the sun this weekend. Still see minor inperferfections upon very close up examination. Perhaps I am expecting perfection and don't really need it. It probably looks better than my paint on my Honda car which is from the factory. If I don't like what it looks like tomorrow....I might just start over and resand the whole thing. I have more base and clear.

Henry
04-27-2013, 09:31 AM
Oh, now it is clear. I tried that tonight. Worked much better. Going to take a good luck at it in the sun this weekend. Still see minor inperferfections upon very close up examination. Perhaps I am expecting perfection and don't really need it. It probably looks better than my paint on my Honda car which is from the factory. If I don't like what it looks like tomorrow....I might just start over and resand the whole thing. I have more base and clear.

Too bad we get critical of ourselves. You should try to perfect what you have because if you submit to repainting you'll end up where you're at right now sanding & buffing. If you have no problems with your basecoat and you didn't sand thru the clear, you could sand the clear with 1000 grit and reclear. I would only consider this if your first job only has little clear from originally painting it and you've sand a ton of it off or you had fault with the clear job. Otherwise, makes no sense to repaint a car because of problems with colorsanding/buffing. Don't forget to wipe your finishwork down with a good clean microfiber cloth. That usually helps make things pop.
Are you using any glaze after compound? What are you using for compound and after; list the products.

Below is a series of short videos made by Robert. Pay attention to the one that pertain to what you're doing and remember he IS using TWO different machines:

http://autobodystore.com/forum/showthread.php?23828-Robert-s-Detailing-Videos

Henry

mike111
04-27-2013, 09:22 PM
Thanks Henry. Played around with it for an hour or so today. I'm not sure the airadvantage is good for me. I got a little better results with these steps:
wet sand with flex pad using 1000 3m wet/dry paper, then 1500
airadvantage sander with trizac 3000 then 4000
wool pad, the orange pad
-using this plan I had NO little circles in there. Those little circle scratches were really making me mad. Used plenty of water and they were still there.

I have only the mystic cut compound. No glazing compound. What's that? Maybe I need something else.

TR3_Nut
05-01-2013, 04:43 PM
Hey Guys

Great thread. So, I just sprayed 4 coats of SPI clear on my car parts, and I'd like to color sand and buff. My question is:
Do I need to sand out every single minute imperfection on a fender or door before I buff? I did a fairly decent painting job and have dust nibs, a few dry spray areas, and some peel. After I sand, I am left with a few specs that are low spots, not reached by the sand paper. I feel like I'm removing a lot of clear if I sand further. Should I just buff and see how it looks? Or should I take a few drops of clear and fill those areas and resand, then buff? What do you think?

This was a garage paint booth spray job and so sometimes, when I got a bit of dust in the paint, it created a little low spot that didn't receive as much clear as other areas.

Thanks much for the advice. Is a 59' Triumph TR3A. Plan to add a large racing stripe from front to back to finish this project (but need to put body and panels on car first).

Pat

http://i987.photobucket.com/albums/ae352/PatGalvin_bucket/Apron3Large_zps207341b1.jpg (http://s987.photobucket.com/user/PatGalvin_bucket/media/Apron3Large_zps207341b1.jpg.html)

http://i987.photobucket.com/albums/ae352/PatGalvin_bucket/RearApron2coatsLarge_zps3c97d08d.jpg (http://s987.photobucket.com/user/PatGalvin_bucket/media/RearApron2coatsLarge_zps3c97d08d.jpg.html)

Len
05-01-2013, 09:17 PM
The amount of sanding will depend on the amount of clear you have on the surface. In most cases it usually pays to use a Nib File to level the dust nibs before you start sanding and that way you remove as little clear as possible. Try a little polishing over some of the sanded imperfections to see if you're satisfied with the result and if not then do more sanding but remember you might blow through the clear and need to repaint.


http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/NibFile.jpg
Nib File Link (http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ABS&Product_Code=S35260&Category_Code=PSH)

mike111
05-08-2013, 10:32 PM
I'm back....been messing with the color sanding. I think I got it...but yes, I have a question.
Background....I have black BC/CC about 1 month old. SPI. I have hand wetsanded all w/ 1000, 1500, then used the airAdvance with 3000. Next I used mystic compound with WOOL, ORANGE, BLACK (in that order). Looks real good even in direct sun. But.....when I wipe it off a little (clean microfiber towel that is new) it leaves ultra tiny little scratches that are only visible in the sun. I dont understand why this is. Could it be that soft? How am ever going to be able to wash it if that's the case? The paint is 4 weeks old.
Second question...is this mystic cut the only product I need? Henry, you mentioned glazing or something. I dont have that, Do I need it?
Lastly, when I finish this long process...what should I protect the finish with?
Thanks
Mike

Len
05-09-2013, 06:56 AM
I'm back....been messing with the color sanding. I think I got it...but yes, I have a question.
Background....I have black BC/CC about 1 month old. SPI. I have hand wetsanded all w/ 1000, 1500, then used the airAdvance with 3000. Next I used mystic compound with WOOL, ORANGE, BLACK (in that order). Looks real good even in direct sun. But.....when I wipe it off a little (clean microfiber towel that is new) it leaves ultra tiny little scratches that are only visible in the sun. I dont understand why this is. Could it be that soft? How am ever going to be able to wash it if that's the case? The paint is 4 weeks old.
Second question...is this mystic cut the only product I need? Henry, you mentioned glazing or something. I dont have that, Do I need it?
Lastly, when I finish this long process...what should I protect the finish with?
Thanks
Mike

Yes, it could be soft enough to show small scratches made by wiping. It may help if you try wiping an area lightly while flushing it with water to remove compound. The Mystic Cut is usually all you need but on soft black paint you may need to go over it with a glaze to make it perfect.


http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/mglm0716.jpg
LINK (http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ABS&Product_Code=MGLM0716&Category_Code=M3)

mike111
05-09-2013, 07:03 AM
Yes, it could be soft enough to show small scratches made by wiping. It may help if you try wiping an area lightly while flushing it with water to remove compound. The Mystic Cut is usually all you need but on soft black paint you may need to go over it with a glaze to make it perfect.


http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/mglm0716.jpg
LINK (http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ABS&Product_Code=MGLM0716&Category_Code=M3)

Thanks Len. So when I do get it all done with the compound and glaze....shouldnt I protect it by waxing?

Len
05-09-2013, 07:05 AM
Thanks Len. So when I do get it all done with the compound and glaze....shouldnt I protect it by waxing?

If you're going to wax it skip the glaze. The wax will do a similar job but it probably won't be as flawless as the glaze.

Robert
05-09-2013, 08:31 AM
A panel can be polished to such a high shine with the machines that just the residue polish being picked up by the cloth can mar the surface a bit. When that happens, I wipe to make sure it's just cloth marring and nothing else and if that's the case, I run my Makita in dual action mode, then when the product is worn out and not yet dry, I switch to random orbital mode and go over the area one more time. This thins the polish down very thin - then - I use wax to take the residue off. I just wax over whatever polish is left, let it dry and wipe off. The wax coats the polish and cloth and keeps away the marring.


Robert

mike111
05-09-2013, 09:32 PM
A panel can be polished to such a high shine with the machines that just the residue polish being picked up by the cloth can mar the surface a bit. When that happens, I wipe to make sure it's just cloth marring and nothing else and if that's the case, I run my Makita in dual action mode, then when the product is worn out and not yet dry, I switch to random orbital mode and go over the area one more time. This thins the polish down very thin - then - I use wax to take the residue off. I just wax over whatever polish is left, let it dry and wipe off. The wax coats the polish and cloth and keeps away the marring.


Robert

Thanks Robert. I really appreciate your help. I had heard that it was a bad idea to wax over paint that was only 30 days old. But coming from you, if that's what you say to do I know it's good advice. I'm going to get this right eventually and post a picture so everyone can see what they helped me do.

Robert
05-09-2013, 10:33 PM
there are breathable waxes/glazes I'd suggest you use one of those. I'm sure it's going to come out great.

Robert

mike111
05-18-2013, 05:54 PM
Still working on the buffing. Finally had couple hours today. It's almost all done with the initial wool pad/mystic cut. Couple things though.
I used almost all the mystic (about 1/4 was wasted learning). It is about a quart I think. When I starting running out today, I noticed the pad was really gummy, the spur wasnt helping much. It was wet. So I started just spraying water on the surface and using the messy pad. Seemed to work as good or better. Am I using too much compound you think?
I sanded in places my buffer wont fit. Some of these areas are dull still. I shouldnt have sanded here. Too late now. I tried to use a dremel buff wheel. It did not go well. Messed up a little spot down to the primer, but do big deal where i did this. Is there a better way to buff these little cracks?
Thanks
Mike

Len
05-18-2013, 09:43 PM
Still working on the buffing. Finally had couple hours today. It's almost all done with the initial wool pad/mystic cut. Couple things though.
I used almost all the mystic (about 1/4 was wasted learning). It is about a quart I think. When I starting running out today, I noticed the pad was really gummy, the spur wasnt helping much. It was wet. So I started just spraying water on the surface and using the messy pad. Seemed to work as good or better. Am I using too much compound you think?
I sanded in places my buffer wont fit. Some of these areas are dull still. I shouldnt have sanded here. Too late now. I tried to use a dremel buff wheel. It did not go well. Messed up a little spot down to the primer, but do big deal where i did this. Is there a better way to buff these little cracks?
Thanks
Mike

A 3" polisher works well in tight spots but other than that you can try to dampen a piece of soft cloth, apply a little Mystic Cut and hand rub. This is the hard way but it can work on a limited basis. At first you can just put one layer of cloth between you fingers and the paint to remove the scratches then ball up the damp cloth to polish the paint.


http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/CP-7201P.jpe
LINK (http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ABS&Product_Code=CP7201P&Category_Code=T2)

Henry
05-19-2013, 10:07 AM
Still working on the buffing. Finally had couple hours today. It's almost all done with the initial wool pad/mystic cut. Couple things though.
I used almost all the mystic (about 1/4 was wasted learning). It is about a quart I think. When I starting running out today, I noticed the pad was really gummy, the spur wasnt helping much. It was wet. So I started just spraying water on the surface and using the messy pad. Seemed to work as good or better. Am I using too much compound you think?
I sanded in places my buffer wont fit. Some of these areas are dull still. I shouldnt have sanded here. Too late now. I tried to use a dremel buff wheel. It did not go well. Messed up a little spot down to the primer, but do big deal where i did this. Is there a better way to buff these little cracks?
Thanks
Mike

Seems a quart is a lot for a vehicle but we can't see what's going on regarding your surface. In actuality, really doesn't matter how your paint surface was painted since we don't use the compound until it's smooth anyway and you've sanded and left behind a scratch fine enough for compound. You can be (not saying you are) using too much product that ends up getting 'flung' off of the surface and wasted. Always best to put a couple ribbons of product on the surface. Example is on a hood. Divide the hood into quarters or halves. Lay out a couple ribbons of product and with a well SEASONED wool pad begin by moving one ribbon with your buffer OFF just to spread the compound on both the surface and the buffing pad. Never any sense to load the entire hood with ribbons of product since you can't and don't need it there and it usually ends up getting wasted. Try doing a 2ft sq area and apply more product as you need it. Keep the next area you are moving to clean. Use a damp towel to wipe off the mess from buffing the first area; dried spray mixed with wool fibers from the compound. Remember to use your compound AS YOUR BUFFER NEEDS IT. Keep your eyes constantly on what the buffing is doing on the surface. You can tell/see when you don't have enough product (compound) and when you're trying to move too much product cause it's too wet.

Below is a link from Len's store on another great group of products by PRESTA. I DO NOT suggest anyone use this method because it is a 3 step process. Before Robert brought us SURE FINISH/Wizard, Presta was the best as far as I'm concerned. Just VERY time consuming because of at least 3 products must be used. However, we can pick one or two of the Prestas and combine it with the Sure Finish or Wizard. One is the Presta 1500 polish and the Presta Swirl Remover (all used with a machine):

http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?

Loosen up and look forward to buffing. Know what you're setting out to do and get it done. Hold the buffer properly and use the correct speed for what you're doing. You never want a buffer running too fast. Slower for the compound effort and a little faster for the glaze or polish. Never run dry and try not to run too wet. The pad can get a little warm but NEVER hot and ALWAYS buff "off" of the panels. Have fun and never look at how big the entire vehicle is; just the 2 sq ft you are working on.

Henry

mike111
05-19-2013, 04:09 PM
Thanks guys. 2 more hours today, all done with the initial wool pad cut. Used some stuff that I got locally at a store because the mystic was gone. It worked but not as good. I see the advantage of the mystic now. It totally removed 1500 grit. So good, that I really dont see a reason to sand up to 3000 next time. The places that I hit with 3000 were only slightly easier to buff and only used slightly more compound.
I used the edge of my t-shirt to buff some cracks and it worked ok. Not great, but looks better. I might try to find a place to buy just the 3" pads and put them on my drill. One other problem is getting the dried compound out of the cracks. Do you think it might was off with a pressure washer?

mike111
05-27-2013, 08:23 PM
Thanks for your help. It is coming along pretty good....
120711207212073

Len
05-27-2013, 08:57 PM
Ya man, that's looking great.

Henry
05-29-2013, 08:24 AM
Thanks for your help. It is coming along pretty good.... 12073

Glad you posted a couple pics. Either a nice camera or a really nice job! Looks great and hope you're proud.

Going forward, like to see you tape off things like the T-Top channel to keep the compound out. Maybe, you can be successful also in using a small and SOFT brush with water to clean the cracks of compound like between the spoiler and bumper cover after your sanding and buffing in that and other areas. You'll find (like all of us) these areas are a pain to clean the longer the compound sits there; like concrete. Be a good habit to create for yourself. We don't do what we should do when we should do it because the excitement of buffing and seeing that perfect paint takes over our minds. I get the same way after SO many years. It just feels good. Wonder if Robert still gets that feeling of detail pride after each job?

Anyway, you done good Mike!

Henry

Kent
05-30-2013, 07:15 AM
Henry,
You have mentioned seasoning the pad a couple times. What is this?

Len
05-30-2013, 10:21 AM
Henry,
You have mentioned seasoning the pad a couple times. What is this?

Before you attach the pad to the buffer wet it and wring it out, install it on the backing plate and give it a quick spin to throw off excess moisture. Apply a pencil length of compound to the painted surface and pick it up with the slowly rotating pad and do this two or three times. This "seasoning" preps the pad for buffing. Use additional compound as needed AND use a spray bottle with water to reactivate the compound on the pad. The water is also applied to the painted surface the picked up with the pad.

Henry
05-30-2013, 12:07 PM
Henry,
You have mentioned seasoning the pad a couple times. What is this?

Len has you covered with an answer and, what the hell he plays golf with Robert so you can take what he says. I just never soaked a pad enough to have to ring it out. I usually take my buffer near a sink and just keep wetting my hand with water and massage the water into the wool fibers so they are damp and hold that dampness. I just don't want too much water. Good time to interject the following:

WARNING TO ALL: ***ELECTRICUTION HAZARD*** Be sure your buffer/extension cord is plugged into a GFCI outlet. It you don't have a dedicated breaker at the panel then add one by simply changing the your wall plug to one that is GFCI protected. I see many people standing in water, extension plug laying in water, spraying water on pad or panel. Both Len & Robert have mentioned this through the years so WORK SMART.

Two main reasons (in my opinion) to season the pad. Not to burn the paint and Maximum use of your product:

Easy to burn paint with a dry pad. You just can't put compound (product) on the surface and use a dry wool pad because it will generate too much heat and after the product is gone (absorbed into the pad or used up on the surface) you will likely create burns in your paint.

Maximum use of product: With a seasoned pad you will run cooler AND allow the product to do more work or do the work which is intended. Always look at the surface you are buffing and add more product depending what you see for results. Learn to occasionally feel the pad to see if it is getting hotter or just warm. Clean the pad with a spur often, do 2 ft sq sections at a time, only apply a ribbon of compound (6" line or a couple 3" lines of compound), have a spray bottle of water to add to the pad and get the job done.

Below is a link to Robert showing and explaining the season process and what a ribbon of product looks like. LOOK AT PICTURES 12, 13 & 14. Nice to look at his entire process and apply the parts you need:

http://www.autobodystore.com/rsw.shtml

Little things make a big difference. One day you can post your own little tricks.

Henry

EDIT= I have no idea if Len or Robert ever played golf but they are in constant contact for our benefit.

mike111
06-08-2013, 10:05 PM
Glad you posted a couple pics. Either a nice camera or a really nice job! Looks great and hope you're proud.

Going forward, like to see you tape off things like the T-Top channel to keep the compound out. Maybe, you can be successful also in using a small and SOFT brush with water to clean the cracks of compound like between the spoiler and bumper cover after your sanding and buffing in that and other areas. You'll find (like all of us) these areas are a pain to clean the longer the compound sits there; like concrete. Be a good habit to create for yourself. We don't do what we should do when we should do it because the excitement of buffing and seeing that perfect paint takes over our minds. I get the same way after SO many years. It just feels good. Wonder if Robert still gets that feeling of detail pride after each job?

Anyway, you done good Mike!

Henry

Thanks Henry. I think it is a combination....it is a good camera but it looks pretty good too. As long as the sun isnt directly on it. I have swirl marks but I've been sidetracked lately. I'll get them taken care of. The compound that was mystic cut seemed to be pretty easy to remove using something called "34 final touch" or something. I forget what it is but it sprays on. THe other compound came off good with some regular "simple green". Generally I stay away from anything that has the word green in it but I make an exception for this cleaner. I always have this around. Yes, you are right....tape next time.

TOGWT
06-10-2013, 03:48 AM
[One other problem is getting the dried compound out of the cracks. Do you think it might was off with a pressure washer? ]

Use an 1:10 isopropyl alcohol / distilled water solution applied with a micro fibre towel wrapped credit card (use one of the wife's /GF ;)) or wrap a toothpick with the towel

xtremekustomz
06-11-2013, 08:16 PM
Thanks for your help. It is coming along pretty good....
120711207212073

Looking good! Sent you a pm.

silentdub
06-19-2013, 10:48 AM
Hey Guys

Great thread. So, I just sprayed 4 coats of SPI clear on my car parts, and I'd like to color sand and buff. My question is:
Do I need to sand out every single minute imperfection on a fender or door before I buff? I did a fairly decent painting job and have dust nibs, a few dry spray areas, and some peel. After I sand, I am left with a few specs that are low spots, not reached by the sand paper. I feel like I'm removing a lot of clear if I sand further. Should I just buff and see how it looks? Or should I take a few drops of clear and fill those areas and resand, then buff? What do you think?

This was a garage paint booth spray job and so sometimes, when I got a bit of dust in the paint, it created a little low spot that didn't receive as much clear as other areas.

Thanks much for the advice. Is a 59' Triumph TR3A. Plan to add a large racing stripe from front to back to finish this project (but need to put body and panels on car first).

Pat

http://i987.photobucket.com/albums/ae352/PatGalvin_bucket/Apron3Large_zps207341b1.jpg (http://s987.photobucket.com/user/PatGalvin_bucket/media/Apron3Large_zps207341b1.jpg.html)

http://i987.photobucket.com/albums/ae352/PatGalvin_bucket/RearApron2coatsLarge_zps3c97d08d.jpg (http://s987.photobucket.com/user/PatGalvin_bucket/media/RearApron2coatsLarge_zps3c97d08d.jpg.html)



I love SPI Clear, it just flows and looks nice, really nice for the price. I just started using their Epoxy and 2K exclusivly. I think it is a good match for my work and abilities. Those parts look really nice.

Good Job sir.

TR3_Nut
08-02-2013, 02:45 PM
So, I've painted the stripe. This was a major PITA. I should have laid the stripe first and back masked to paint white. Instead, I had little bits of british racing green sneak around my masking and stick to my sanded clear (on the white basecoat). So, had to go back and dust on some white and reclear. Total PITA.
Live and learn. This isn't the easiest first paint job I could have chosen. I really like the stripe though.

So, i've tried a little color sanding and buffing. It is really difficult to do this on white paint as you cannot see the highs and lows very well. I saw a Kevin Tetz video the other day where he used a black marker on his clear as a guide coat, both for initial sanding as well as between some grits. Allowed him to be sure he removed the defects as well as the scratches from coarser grits.

My clear is a week old and has been in 90 degree heat all week, in the sun. Any concerns about using this sharpie marker method? Am I crazy to put that on my new clear coat over white BC?

Thanks

Pat

http://i987.photobucket.com/albums/ae352/PatGalvin_bucket/TR3%20Body%20and%20Paint/001Large_zps0c9c0e0e.jpg (http://s987.photobucket.com/user/PatGalvin_bucket/media/TR3%20Body%20and%20Paint/001Large_zps0c9c0e0e.jpg.html)

http://i987.photobucket.com/albums/ae352/PatGalvin_bucket/TR3%20Body%20and%20Paint/002Large_zpsbfe36e68.jpg (http://s987.photobucket.com/user/PatGalvin_bucket/media/TR3%20Body%20and%20Paint/002Large_zpsbfe36e68.jpg.html)

http://i987.photobucket.com/albums/ae352/PatGalvin_bucket/TR3%20Body%20and%20Paint/003Large_zps9d93d17a.jpg (http://s987.photobucket.com/user/PatGalvin_bucket/media/TR3%20Body%20and%20Paint/003Large_zps9d93d17a.jpg.html)

Len
08-02-2013, 05:02 PM
Don't use a solvent based marker it can stain the paint and the stain could go too deeply to remove with sanding and polishing. Use either a water based marker or dedicated guide coat. Personally I would dust it with a light coat of SEM black guide coat, it's much less aggressive.



http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/sem38203.jpg (http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ABS&Product_Code=SEM38203&Category_Code=PSH)