View Full Version : Paint the Met
12-27-2005, 08:01 PM
Ok,I am a novice,:eek: got the Met down to bare metal here is what I want to do which is different than what I can do, spray Omni Epoxy primer on the bare metal to seal it sand smooth and spray a lacquer primer followed by the finish coat of enamel. I do not want to use a bc/cc as this is not of the period and the bc/cc looks to modern.
Thank you :rolleyes:
12-27-2005, 08:18 PM
There is no reason to sand the epoxy primer, you can spray your build lacquer primer right on top of the epoxy primer without sanding IF you spray the lacquer build primer within the epoxy drying time window. I've waited a couple days before spraying anything on top of the Omni epoxy and it worked fine. The spec sheet for the primer will tell you what the recoat time window is, I don't remember right now. Lacquer topcoat paint is not my first choice of paint in this day and age but it will work fine on your metro. Those sure are cute little cars, I almost bought a turquoise and white one a few years back, but the deal fell through. Don't they have an MG 4 cylinder engine ?
12-28-2005, 08:39 AM
Thank for the advice, Some places on the car like the passenger door I used #36 as the bondo was at least 1/2 in thick, dang dent was set in its way and with out the use of a stud gun iI welded a few 3/16 bolts to the door took a piece of hard maple, drilled a hole in it and commenced to pull the dent, did not have to use much filler. Anyway I most likely will not get around to a finish coat until spring maybe sooner but outside the window. Another thing what do you use to keep the door from oil canning? it pops out right away can I weld a piece of metal on the inside of the door.
12-28-2005, 09:08 AM
I wouldn't use the lacquer primer , especially over the epoxy. I have sprayed lacquer top coat over epoxy; it is not recommended. In these situations is was because the paint was in lacquer form only. However, since you are using epoxy....why not either sand the epoxy and paint over it, or use a urethane primer? I have done a lot of painting directly over sanded epoxy. It does matter about the type of epoxy, because some don't sand easily. I use Kirker which also fills pretty well. If your Omni doesn't do either, then I would look into some urethane primer. You can be assured there will be no compatibility issues and the weakest link will now be your topcoat of enamel. That measn down the road if you repaint it, you only need to sand off the enamel, the base
( undercoats ) with be sound :)
Lost in NJ
12-28-2005, 10:16 AM
As pointed out, you really do not want to spray non-two part paints (2K). I ended up putting Concept on which is a urethane paint single stage.
If you do a great job putting the Concept on it can look like glass. Not a problem, just buff it out and it will look more like the original paint. Yes it will look better than the original, but no, not too many people will notice. Consider this, many high point show cars have this type of paint on them.
There are other issues that make it impossible to get the exact look of the original finish. The tints today are much different than back then so the colors are missing some 'muddyness' that affects the original patina. Unless you are super particular you are way better off not worrying too much. Get a close representation of the original color and use the modern primers and topcoats.
It is so much better working with the new paints. You will be quite pleased if you switch over. Be sure to read all the tech sheets and pay attention to advice given out by Len and other here. Read about the new techniques for sanding the primer and the dry color sanding and buffing.
12-28-2005, 08:48 PM
WisconsinJimmy, with all due respect I desagree with Pete and Lost in NJ about epoxy primer being topcoated with lacquer primer. The epoxy primers I've been using (Transtar and Omni) can be topcoated with lacquer primer with no negative side effects. I would suggest that when you're all done block sanding the lacquer primer and the car is ready to paint in the paint booth then spray on a couple medium coats of epoxy primer over the lacquer primer to be used as a sealer coat. That will serve the purpose of the working as a barrier coat between the acrylic ename topcoat paint and the lacquer primer. (Its too involved to get into absorption characteristic of lacquer primer being topcoated with acrylic enamel. It is also very important that the lacquer primer have at least a couple weeks to air dry before you topcoat it with either epoxy or acrylic enamel. That lacquer primer needs time to "off gas" the lacquer thinners which are part of the primer application. If that primer is not allowed enough time to off gas then a layer of lacquer thinner can get trapped between the upper surface of the lacquer primer and the bottom surface of the epoxy or acrylic enamel. The bottom line is that tapped solvents can cause a serious delamination problem. I have stripped entire cars quickly with just a razor blade because of trapped solvent/paint delamination problem.
I DO agree with the other guys in that the modern materials we use now are a lot better products with a lot less problems than the older low tech materials like lacquer primer and acylic enamel topcoat paint. It should also be pointed out that those "low tech" products were used successfully for close to 30 years. Through the years I've had several show cars that were done in lacquer primer with an acrylic enamel color coat. So its not that the older materials are bad, its just the newer materials are better.
About two years ago we stripped a Vette, applied epoxy primer then 2K primer then several applications of lacquer top coat. We did this because the customer wanted lacquer and we don't really like lacquer primer so we went with more modern primers. The car has won many local shows and looks as good today as it did when we painted it. There is one negative side effect that I did notice, the lacquer doesn't bond as well to the primer as other types of top coats but the car is a show car and only comes out of storage on nice days so it will probably outlast the owner. As far as I'm concerned lacquer primer belongs in the same trash can as lacquer putty and while they may work there are much better alternatives.
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