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silentdub
11-10-2011, 11:44 AM
Guys, this clear coat is awesome. I don't know where or what it's made of, but damn it looks awesome!

I laid 2 wet coats down on this fender and I can't even see any Orange Peel. This stuff is like the coating on a fresh candy apple. At best, if you have a small project, try this stuff out.

I sprayed several clears, some from TCPGlobal and PPG. This puts PPG to shame and this is coming from someone with limited experience in painting and I mean very limited.

The SPI is a little heavier than the PPG stuff, thicker too, it takes a little getting used to in order to lay the wet coats without runs, but I am sure it will be a joke for some of you guys with experience.

I used a Devilbliss PLUS gune with a 1.4 tip, about 15PSI at the cap.

I only had a crappy camera pic, but I have some bike parts to do, I'll use a good camera and take some pics.

Len
11-10-2011, 11:48 AM
Guys, this clear coat is awesome. I don't know where or what it's made of, but damn it looks awesome!

I laid 2 wet coats down on this fender and I can't even see any Orange Peel. This stuff is like the coating on a fresh candy apple. At best, if you have a small project, try this stuff out.

I sprayed several clears, some from TCPGlobal and PPG. This puts PPG to shame and this is coming from someone with limited experience in painting and I mean very limited.

The SPI is a little heavier than the PPG stuff, thicker too, it takes a little getting used to in order to lay the wet coats without runs, but I am sure it will be a joke for some of you guys with experience.

I used a Devilbliss PLUS gune with a 1.4 tip, about 15PSI at the cap.

I only had a crappy camera pic, but I have some bike parts to do, I'll use a good camera and take some pics.

How do you know that you had 15 PSI at the cap?

silentdub
11-10-2011, 12:00 PM
How do you know that you had 15 PSI at the cap?


I have a regulator on the gun itself, wide open, 15psi was on the gauge.

JCCLARK
11-10-2011, 12:03 PM
Do you have a gage that can be fitted at the cap?
(15 psi at the gun is not 15 psi at the cap.)

Len
11-10-2011, 12:05 PM
I have a regulator on the gun itself, wide open, 15psi was on the gauge.

Inlet pressure on that gun should be about 30 PSI which will probably give you around 11 or 12 PSI at the cap.

frostje
11-10-2011, 12:13 PM
what should it be at the compressor if you have a 50ft hose? Reason I ask is my regulator at my gun broke. This is just a temp problem.

silentdub
11-10-2011, 12:17 PM
Inlet pressure on that gun should be about 30 PSI which will probably give you around 11 or 12 PSI at the cap.

Interesting, I'd like to get a new gauge too, the one that came with the gun goes up to like 100psi, not sure anyone needs that. I was thinking inlet pressure was at the cap, but it's all good, this stuff sprays really nice.


My compressor kicks on at about 110PSI and off at 155psi, so before the gun, the psi is somewhere in between. I don't regulate it at the compressor.


I think 30 psi at inlet was too high, I was getting some what appeared like overly dry clear and a lot of mist in the air, the lower pressure gave me a nice coat.

Len
11-10-2011, 12:28 PM
Interesting, I'd like to get a new gauge too, the one that came with the gun goes up to like 100psi, not sure anyone needs that. I was thinking inlet pressure was at the cap, but it's all good, this stuff sprays really nice.


My compressor kicks on at about 110PSI and off at 155psi, so before the gun, the psi is somewhere in between. I don't regulate it at the compressor.


I think 30 psi at inlet was too high, I was getting some what appeared like overly dry clear and a lot of mist in the air, the lower pressure gave me a nice coat.

I agree that you'll never use the regulator at a pressure above 40 PSI but you should be regulating the pressure that goes into the hose so that you get a consistent pressure at the gun. I usually put about 70 PSI into the hose then regulate the inlet pressure at the gun to the pressure recommended by the gun's manufacturer.

silentdub
11-10-2011, 01:12 PM
I agree that you'll never use the regulator at a pressure above 40 PSI but you should be regulating the pressure that goes into the hose so that you get a consistent pressure at the gun. I usually put about 70 PSI into the hose then regulate the inlet pressure at the gun to the pressure recommended by the gun's manufacturer.



Good point, I'll start doing that just to be safe.

Wydir
11-10-2011, 02:45 PM
what should it be at the compressor if you have a 50ft hose? Reason I ask is my regulator at my gun broke. This is just a temp problem.

I would go with 10-15 psi higher so if you want 30psi at the gun set the comp reg at 40-45psi


and
silentdub what PPG clears are you compairing this SPI clear to ? that it puts it to shame.

silentdub
11-10-2011, 02:56 PM
I would go with 10-15 psi higher so if you want 30psi at the gun set the comp reg at 40-45psi


and
silentdub what PPG clears are you compairing this SPI clear to ? that it puts it to shame.



Well the ppg shopline isn't even up to be compared to, I picked up a gallon of SPI and it mixes 1:1 so you get 2 gallons of spray, it comes out to the same price as the PPG shopline.

I've used Shopline, Deltron, Omni, Kustom Shop clears.

While I didn't use an $800/gal Glasurit to compare it to, this stuff looks very good. Pick up a small pot and try it. It is worth the try.

For the same price to the shopline, it looks better than the Deltron.


Len, you should try it out and maybe sell it yourself. I currently get it from the source, but I like to order from you since I get everything the next day since we are so close.

Wydir
11-10-2011, 04:13 PM
Well the ppg shopline isn't even up to be compared to, I picked up a gallon of SPI and it mixes 1:1 so you get 2 gallons of spray, it comes out to the same price as the PPG shopline.

I've used Shopline, Deltron, Omni, Kustom Shop clears.

While I didn't use an $800/gal Glasurit to compare it to, this stuff looks very good. Pick up a small pot and try it. It is worth the try.

For the same price to the shopline, it looks better than the Deltron.


Len, you should try it out and maybe sell it yourself. I currently get it from the source, but I like to order from you since I get everything the next day since we are so close.


Well there are 24 clears in the deltron line, 11 clears in shopline and 7 clears in omni and spi is better than all of them?
well for not being an experienced painter you have sprayed way more clears than I have. ha and I did not even get to the kustom shop clears.

So what one did you use since there are 7 Spi clears?

I have looked at spi before just never bit the bullet to pick up a couple gallons

I have been using DC4000 and DCU2021(these cost me about 110.00 per gallon kit) this is 1 gallon & 1 quart sprayable

I see the SPI clears are around the same price some are higher so to me it would cost more to use SPI stuff, and I hate to lose money.
a couple of the SPI clears are 3/4 gallon and 1 quart kit so only 1 gallon sprayable which makes it even more expensive.

I will break down and try some, I just dont know when maybe this spring. By then you can give us an update on how it holds up or any issues with sanding or buffing.

QuickXR
11-11-2011, 04:30 AM
I just finished spraying my wife's mustang black using SPI universal clear. This stuff is great. Lays slick and smooth, easy as hell to wetsand( 1 week later). I will never use another clear again but SPI. I used a Plus gun with 1.4 tip, 32 psi.

JCCLARK
11-11-2011, 05:55 AM
The SPI is a polyurethane, most clears are just urethanes.
Nothing wrong with urethanes but keep in mind, in order to
be used for aircraft the clear has to pass the skydrol test and
only a true poly will do that, SPI passes that test.
So it is a great clear.
SPI has other clears too, the Universal is a soft clear making it
ideal for flexible items and plastic parts, and easy buffing.
But for dark color cars their Euro clear is harder and easier to keep
the buffing swirls out of.
I have the universal on my daily driver now for 5 yrs, never waxed
and still looks as good as day 1.
So I like it a lot:)

jeremyb
11-11-2011, 06:18 AM
The only clear they have in 3/4 gallon is the MS clear. Reason it is packaged this way is because it is a 3:1 mix. You are buying exactly 4 quarts of mixed clear. No wasted hardener sitting on your shelf. If you paint everyday, not a big deal to have that extra hardener for the next gallon. For the guy who might not paint for the next 6-12 months and is trying to keep his cost down it means the world. The turbo clear used to be packaged this way, but has since been discontinued in lieu of their Euro clear. If you want the cheap stuff, keep using the ppg. :D

Len
11-11-2011, 07:49 AM
I just finished spraying my wife's mustang black using SPI universal clear. This stuff is great. Lays slick and smooth, easy as hell to wetsand( 1 week later). I will never use another clear again but SPI. I used a Plus gun with 1.4 tip, 32 psi.

The true test of a good paint is how well it holds up over time. Almost all paint will look good right after it's sprayed but a couple years later will tell you how it compares with other products. Have you used many other paint products?

Len
11-11-2011, 07:54 AM
The SPI is a polyurethane, most clears are just urethanes.
Nothing wrong with urethanes but keep in mind, in order to
be used for aircraft the clear has to pass the skydrol test and
only a true poly will do that, SPI passes that test.
So it is a great clear.
SPI has other clears too, the Universal is a soft clear making it
ideal for flexible items and plastic parts, and easy buffing.
But for dark color cars their Euro clear is harder and easier to keep
the buffing swirls out of.
I have the universal on my daily driver now for 5 yrs, never waxed
and still looks as good as day 1.
So I like it a lot:)

The first urethane on the market was poly and as the technology improved most of the major manufacturers went to acrylic urethane.

JCCLARK
11-11-2011, 09:12 AM
I've been told the urethanes are a little more user friendly as
far as spraying, I never have noticed a difference personally.
I have used several of the cheapest clears I could find over
the past 20 yrs for my collision repairs and all of them held
up just fine.
I haven't had a failure or return from any of them.
But realistically, for those jobs, most owners don't
keep their cars long enough to know.:D

jeremyb
11-11-2011, 10:23 AM
Len, are you saying that a modern acrylic urethane clear is superior to a true modern polyurethane clear?

If so...could you please explain for those that have NO clue.

Mooch
11-11-2011, 10:40 AM
While i have used some SPI products and found the product to be fine . I have to ask ..is this thread an add for SPI ?

I always wonder when someone comes on site and recommends a product and flames another one we have used for years with good results .

I suspect this thread is an add for SPI and should be posted as an add .

Mooch

JCCLARK
11-11-2011, 12:06 PM
Len, are you saying that a modern acrylic urethane clear is superior to a true modern polyurethane clear?

If so...could you please explain for those that have NO clue.

No where did he even hint towards that.

jeremyb
11-11-2011, 12:13 PM
No where did he even hint towards that.

Ah, then I misinterpreted.

Len
11-11-2011, 12:40 PM
Ah, then I misinterpreted.

It's my understanding that after the second world war the Germans were not permitted to use certain chemicals so they couldn't paint their cars with chemicals that were available at the time. Well, leave it to the Germans, they came up with better products, mainly urethane paints and hence polyurethane. I believe that the urethane evolved from poly to acrylic in order to add attributes like UV protection and color enhancement but that's just my own understanding and I'm sure that acrylic urethane has other features that older products didn't have. The first polyurethane that I used was DuPont Imron which was VERY dangerous to spray but I don't know if the more recent poly products are just as dangerous. All hardened paints are quite toxic so be sure to wear "good" breath protection when spraying anything with a hardener in the mix.

Wydir
11-11-2011, 01:19 PM
The only clear they have in 3/4 gallon is the MS clear. Reason it is packaged this way is because it is a 3:1 mix. You are buying exactly 4 quarts of mixed clear. No wasted hardener sitting on your shelf. If you paint everyday, not a big deal to have that extra hardener for the next gallon. For the guy who might not paint for the next 6-12 months and is trying to keep his cost down it means the world. The turbo clear used to be packaged this way, but has since been discontinued in lieu of their Euro clear. If you want the cheap stuff, keep using the ppg. :D

the PPG clear that I use is mix 4:1 so there is no left over hardener so your argument has no meaning.

jeremyb
11-11-2011, 01:49 PM
the PPG clear that I use is mix 4:1 so there is no left over hardener so your argument has no meaning.

You totally missed the point, and I wasn't looking for an argument. The point is, their MS clear is a 3:1 mix. Most other companies out there that have a 3:1 mix clear do not fill their gallon can up with only 3/4 product...much like sikkens HS+ that I've used for years. You have to buy 2 qt hardeners (that is how i purchase the hardener, not by the gallon) and only use maybe a 1/4 of the 2nd one to finish off the gallon of clear...therefore leaving you with leftover hardener that may go un-used for a long time after opening.

You made it a point to mention some of their products being only a 3/4 gallon for some reason....I was merely pointing out why. How dare them not make a customer buy extra hardener that they may never need again.....can't believe they would be on the lookout for the customer. So which costs more? SPI being 3/4 full or other 3:1 mix products that require you to buy that extra hardener that may go wasted?

QuickXR
11-11-2011, 03:21 PM
The true test of a good paint is how well it holds up over time. Almost all paint will look good right after it's sprayed but a couple years later will tell you how it compares with other products. Have you used many other paint products?

I've used the PPG Omni line, granted not top of the line, but on par with SPI as far as price goes. The Omni clear sucks in comparison, hard as hell to wetsand, no where near the gloss right out of the gun and no matter what you try to do, there is always orange peel. With the SPI, orange peel free finish the very 1st time i used it(it would be hard to use on production work to match factory orange peel). I used pro-spray base under the clear, coverage was quick, total hiding in 2 coats. I hear the SPI holds up well, although this will not be a daily driver anymore.

I'm not advertising for SPI, but was merely agreeing with the OP on how well the product was.

Len
11-11-2011, 03:42 PM
I've used the PPG Omni line, granted not top of the line, but on par with SPI as far as price goes. The Omni clear sucks in comparison, hard as hell to wetsand, no where near the gloss right out of the gun and no matter what you try to do, there is always orange peel. With the SPI, orange peel free finish the very 1st time i used it(it would be hard to use on production work to match factory orange peel). I used pro-spray base under the clear, coverage was quick, total hiding in 2 coats. I hear the SPI holds up well, although this will not be a daily driver anymore.

I'm not advertising for SPI, but was merely agreeing with the OP on how well the product was.

Thanks for your input, if I get a chance I may check out some SPI products.

silentdub
11-11-2011, 11:16 PM
Damn guys, not trying to start a war here. This is not an SPI ad either, I simply used the product three or four times now and I love how it lays. It self levels and looks really good.

I have been doing small jobs for the most part like bike parts and what not and when I gave this stuff a try it was like out of the box awesome. No buffing or wet sanding required for any type of great gloss. Lay it how you want it to look and man it is like it is inside a candy shell. I'll see how it holds up though, even if for one of my soon to be show cars, I'll use this because it looks so deep and awesome.

Maybe since it is softer that it not be used for a daily driver out in the sun all day, but still for an out of the box shine like this, it's hard to get that from other products.

Wydir
11-11-2011, 11:18 PM
You totally missed the point, and I wasn't looking for an argument. The point is, their MS clear is a 3:1 mix. Most other companies out there that have a 3:1 mix clear do not fill their gallon can up with only 3/4 product...much like sikkens HS+ that I've used for years. You have to buy 2 qt hardeners (that is how i purchase the hardener, not by the gallon) and only use maybe a 1/4 of the 2nd one to finish off the gallon of clear...therefore leaving you with leftover hardener that may go un-used for a long time after opening.

You made it a point to mention some of their products being only a 3/4 gallon for some reason....I was merely pointing out why. How dare them not make a customer buy extra hardener that they may never need again.....can't believe they would be on the lookout for the customer. So which costs more? SPI being 3/4 full or other 3:1 mix products that require you to buy that extra hardener that may go wasted?

If you re read my first post. You are trying to explain to me what I already said. so again you were no help to me

boy I guess im missing out on using 3:1 clear then huh...(the point of the 3:1 comment I made is that you only get 1 gallon sprayable material, And with the PPG clears I use I get 1 gallon and 1 quart sprayable for the same cost ) To bad for me,I will just stick with my PPG 4:1 clears and not worry about it.

The only thing I was interested in is what exact PPG clear he was comparing it to.

silentdub
11-11-2011, 11:24 PM
boy I guess im missing out on using 3:1 clear then huh...(the point of the 3:1 comment I made is that you only get 1 gallon sprayable material, And with the PPG clears I use I get 1 gallon and 1 quart sprayable for the same cost ) To bad for me,I will just stick with my PPG 4:1 clears and not worry about it.

The only thing I was interested in is what exact PPG clear he was comparing it to.


I don't remember the numbers off hand, I'll have to check the cans. I did a few projects with different materials so it is hard to keep track. I think the one ppg was a universal clear, J something.


I am going to be painting my mail box, I am going to use SPI clear on it and see how it holds up in the weather 100% of the time. This won't account for the air speeds and sandblasting, but will be a true sign of the weather.

another2centsworth
11-11-2011, 11:49 PM
Been hanging out with dub here for a few years...he is ok....wish you could say that for me wydir....

Wydir
11-12-2011, 12:15 AM
Been hanging out with dub here for a few years...he is ok....wish you could say that for me wydir....

I dont have any problems with anyone here all good information passing through these screens

I got like 20 posts what the hell do I know......I cant be trusted hahaha

If I say something stupid let me know. If I give bad advice let me know........ Im always learning and am not stuck in my ways and open to new ideas.

what ever happened to the heated paint gun ? Did that just go away or are peeps using it ?

If I may have offended anyone I am sorry.

jeremyb
11-12-2011, 08:40 AM
So pretty much MS and Universal are the 2 clears that are higher priced than what you are using. Do you use 4000 and 2021 on resto jobs? I was always under the assumption that the preffered clear in ppg for resto jobs was 2002 (or conecpt for SS).

Sorry just trying to understand you when you said SPI would cost you more money.

Wydir
11-12-2011, 12:18 PM
I do not do resto jobs not for 10+ years

Just minor repairs, Bumper covers , most I do now is truck boxes and the bottom half of vehicles. I live in wisconsin so I get alot of rust repair/rock chip work on front covers rockers and truck boxes, my latest was a 05 cadillac CTS front Deer hit.

My main clear is DC4000 I have both DBC and Envirobase Mixing Systems

another2centsworth
11-12-2011, 05:47 PM
I dont have any problems with anyone here all good information passing through these screens

I got like 20 posts what the hell do I know......I cant be trusted hahaha

If I say something stupid let me know. If I give bad advice let me know........ Im always learning and am not stuck in my ways and open to new ideas.

what ever happened to the heated paint gun ? Did that just go away or are peeps using it ?

If I may have offended anyone I am sorry.

I have always like you wydir. You add to the site here and I'm glad. :oath:
You never ran Len down once like others on refinish.
Wonder who's changed their name from refinish and joined here incognito. PM me..LOL!! Just kidding.
Personally I like both my 4:1 clears and 2:1 euro just fine.
5 qts sprayable is fine with me. 8)
Only time I buy more than one qt hardener is for 2:1 euro. No need otherwise.
Never sprayed 3:1 clear. Not knocking it.

skip99
11-13-2011, 03:31 PM
wydir...where you get ppg 2021 for $100 a gallon? or is that a qt?

Don Meyer
11-13-2011, 08:38 PM
I used PPG clears for yrs....no more. SPI's universal clear Is the best you can buy.

Don Meyer

Len
11-13-2011, 09:58 PM
I used PPG clears for yrs....no more. SPI's universal clear Is the best you can buy.

Don Meyer

If that's true I wonder why more high-end shops don't use it. I know a lot of shops in this area and nobody I know uses it.

Wydir
11-13-2011, 11:58 PM
wydir...where you get ppg 2021 for $100 a gallon? or is that a qt?

I do not buy quarts of clear.

I have great hook ups for PPG products

silentdub
11-14-2011, 10:39 AM
If that's true I wonder why more high-end shops don't use it. I know a lot of shops in this area and nobody I know uses it.



Not many jobbers stock it I guess, most places are Dupont or PPG and they try to offer their full line. As one person said PPG won't warranty the base unless you use their clear and the PPG clear is fine for everyday repairs where the customer doesn't even know what clear coat is.

I used the PPG Shopline product several times and it took several more coats to get the look of the SPI. The SPI just worked better over the PPG Shopline base and their Global base, or what was once called global.



I would really like your input Len, I am almost willing to buy your a quart of the stuff so you can check it out and let us all know what you think. I know what I think and I just ordered another gallon of SPI for this Honda Accord that I am working on.

JCCLARK
11-14-2011, 12:06 PM
Like I said, I've had the SPI Universal clear on my daily driver
for 5 yrs now, never even waxed and it still looks like new.
That's good enough for me.:D

silentdub
11-14-2011, 12:31 PM
Like I said, I've had the SPI Universal clear on my daily driver
for 5 yrs now, never even waxed and it still looks like new.
That's good enough for me.:D


I saw your original post, I have only recently sprayed cars with it, so I wouldn't know, but ya know what, if it means I have to buff it once a year to keep the look, then I am with it.

Most regular clears dry up, get some white chalky stuff to them and don't look as good later in life, this clear is like having the 'wet' look all of the time. It is like putting some armor all on your tires.

I just ordered some more, I'll spray some bike parts and post some good pictures.

Wydir
11-14-2011, 11:57 PM
PPG Global Base is PPG's top of the Line solvent Base it did not go anywhere or is called anything else, If you are putting Shopline clear on Global base just makes no sense at all(who does this). To me you are comparing this SPI stuff to shopline Clear and Omni Clear. and not Deltron or Global clears.

To me it just seems when it comes to PPG products you have no idea what your talking about.

You should of just said that you used some SPI products and you very much enjoyed your experience with them, And left it at that instead of saying that its better than any clear that PPG has ever made.

jeremyb
11-15-2011, 06:30 AM
PPG Global Base is PPG's top of the Line solvent Base it did not go anywhere or is called anything else, If you are putting Shopline clear on Global base just makes no sense at all(who does this). To me you are comparing this SPI stuff to shopline Clear and Omni Clear. and not Deltron or Global clears.

To me it just seems when it comes to PPG products you have no idea what your talking about.

You should of just said that you used some SPI products and you very much enjoyed your experience with them, And left it at that instead of saying that its better than any clear that PPG has ever made.

It doesn't make sense to put a lower quality clear on high quality base, but it happens more than you think in even the biggest of body shops. Anything they can do to make themselves THINK they are saving money.

Seems like he has it straightened out now though, by using SPI. :D dub, I would ditch the Shopline base though. You are better off spending more money for DBC or Global.

silentdub
11-15-2011, 09:09 AM
I've used PPG Global with the same level of clear, never used shopline clear on a global base.

To be honest, once I finish off what of the shopline clear I have left, I am done with it. For the price, SPI Clear is above PPG.

Wydir
11-15-2011, 12:02 PM
I've used PPG Global with the same level of clear, never used shopline clear on a global base.

To be honest, once I finish off what of the shopline clear I have left, I am done with it. For the price, SPI Clear is above PPG.

There you go again ...... I am almost certain you have only used shopline clear. and another thing most of us painters dont use the lower lines of ppg we only used the higher end products. we are also paying for the good stuff what normal people that walk off the street pay for the shopline.

I have used a shopline clear ounce it was JC661(recommended by another painter) cost $50 for a gallon kit. it was not to bad. sanded easy buffed out nice . used it on a 2005 truck bed just talked to the owner says he uses it to haul wood through the woods but says it still looks great.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc277/Dwydir/IMG00179-20110602-2038.jpg

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc277/Dwydir/04F1506.jpg

Mooch
11-15-2011, 12:14 PM
While i have no problem with SPI products and have used some in the past . It would be interesting to know just how many of the guys raving over SPI are members of the SPI forum ?

Mooch

jeremyb
11-15-2011, 01:06 PM
While i have no problem with SPI products and have used some in the past . It would be interesting to know just how many of the guys raving over SPI are members of the SPI forum ?

Mooch

Since you are dying for a reply in this thread, what does that have to do with anything? Can't be a member of another forum if you are a spi forum member? I don't get it.

Wydir, the price you are getting for that ppg is no doubt a deal of a century. Most of us "pros" don't get stuff at a price like that. Even with my discount with sikkens, I can't get any of their clears for that price. I sure do wish though..LOL!! Even at that price, SPI Euro2020 is cheaper per sprayable quart (requires urethane reducer for best results) :D That is the clear you should be comparing to 2021 and 4000. The 2.1 production clear is even cheaper (no reducer).

QuickXR
11-15-2011, 01:07 PM
While i have no problem with SPI products and have used some in the past . It would be interesting to know just how many of the guys raving over SPI are members of the SPI forum ?

Mooch
I'm also a member of the SPI forum. Also a member of the Hotrodders forum, but i don't use the POS harbor freight spraygun they praise about for $15. It's simple for me, i tried the SPI clear based on others views, now i won't use any other stuff. Sure i have used the PPG cheaper clear line, junk IMHO compared to SPI. Haven't used the top of the line PPG clear, but i never will try it due to the cost.

silentdub
11-15-2011, 02:23 PM
While i have no problem with SPI products and have used some in the past . It would be interesting to know just how many of the guys raving over SPI are members of the SPI forum ?

Mooch

There's an SPI forum here? I never even knew it existed!

silentdub
11-15-2011, 02:39 PM
[QUOTE=Wydir;186056]There you go again ...... I am almost certain you have only used shopline clear. and another thing most of us painters dont use the lower lines of ppg we only used the higher end products. we are also paying for the good stuff what normal people that walk off the street pay for the shopline.

I have used a shopline clear ounce it was JC661(recommended by another painter) cost $50 for a gallon kit. it was not to bad. sanded easy buffed out nice . used it on a 2005 truck bed just talked to the owner says he uses it to haul wood through the woods but says it still looks great.


I used several difference clears, 2002 2042, cromaclear Dupont 7600, I basically had some people bring me their job and they supplied the stuff, I recently used the PPG shopline on a car and some misc bike parts, it looks ok, just nothing to write home about. It laid nice and flat but it just seems to me that the SPI just looks thicker, with more body to it, not to mention 1:1 mixing for the UC, so you get 2 gallons of actual spray.

I understand that shopline is crap, but that is what I most recently used, so that I what I base my opinion on. The SPI seems to lay with little to no orange peel, very glossy with NO buffing. With this being said, I used all of the clears with the same Devilbliss Plus gun, the SPI looked and laid the best.

Now, I have to admit, that I am a total Newb at painting, not a lot of experience, so maybe the SPI is just easier to work with. The first time I used it, I had some runs and sags, it appears to be heavier than the PPG clears, once I got the hang of it, it worked well.


I heard Len talk about Glasurit and like products for $800.00 a gal, I am a long way off from using that and they may be superior however, when it comes to having 2 gallons for under $200.00 and the results are 10 times better than anything else at that price, it is a no brainer.

Maybe better clears require a good clear gun? This may be the case, but as long as I have my Plus, I haven't found anything better yet.


If some of you Pro PPG or Dupont guys know of a good clear coat as good as SPI appears to be for $100.00/gal, please let me know and I'll give them a try.

silentdub
11-15-2011, 02:48 PM
I did do a quick search and SPI does have a forum on their site. I'll be sure to check it out.

I also found a good thread: http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/spi-clear-70552.html It's worth a read, other people are real happy with the product.

I am currently not a member of either site.

Mooch
11-15-2011, 04:43 PM
Since you are dying for a reply in this thread, what does that have to do with anything? Can't be a member of another forum if you are a spi forum member? I don't get it.

Wydir, the price you are getting for that ppg is no doubt a deal of a century. Most of us "pros" don't get stuff at a price like that. Even with my discount with sikkens, I can't get any of their clears for that price. I sure do wish though..LOL!! Even at that price, SPI Euro2020 is cheaper per sprayable quart (requires urethane reducer for best results) :D That is the clear you should be comparing to 2021 and 4000. The 2.1 production clear is even cheaper (no reducer).

I was just wondering what site you were talking about on the spi forum ?


I just spent about 10 min reading some "hate mail" on another forum, about SPI clears and how they just dont perform over the big guys' clear that cost 3 times as much.

Mooch

jeremyb
11-15-2011, 05:09 PM
Ahhh...I have a secret admirer I see...well not so secret anymore.

I Certainly wasn't talking about here. :oath:

Len
11-15-2011, 05:28 PM
Now, I have to admit, that I am a total Newb at painting, not a lot of experience, so maybe the SPI is just easier to work with. The first time I used it, I had some runs and sags, it appears to be heavier than the PPG clears, once I got the hang of it, it worked well.


I heard Len talk about Glasurit and like products for $800.00 a gal, I am a long way off from using that and they may be superior however, when it comes to having 2 gallons for under $200.00 and the results are 10 times better than anything else at that price, it is a no brainer.

Maybe better clears require a good clear gun? This may be the case, but as long as I have my Plus, I haven't found anything better yet.

The $800 a gallon is for color not for clear. Clear is a lot less expensive but I don't know the exact amount of Glasurit clear. When I'm doing a $10,000 paint job I usually don't ask the price of the paint but I'll find out and let you know.

Actually the better paint products are usually easier to use not harder and tend to be more forgiving of which gun is used but why spend a lot of money on paint and use a cheap gun to put it on.

Next time I have less important work to clear I'll may give the SPI a try but that won't tell me too much because there's no way of telling how well it holds up to UV, acid rain or how easy it is to repair.... unless, of course, I screw it up and need to repair it. Almost any clear will look good if it's applied properly, time will tell it's true quality.

Mooch
11-15-2011, 05:51 PM
Ahhh...I have a secret admirer I see...well not so secret anymore.

I Certainly wasn't talking about here. :oath:

I didn't think you were talking about here . I was asking you which site ? Is a secret ? I visit a lot of sites including SPI and was a member when they first started up a few years back .

I have never saw a site knock SPI products but i have seen SPI members knock other products .

Even some members who really haven't painted enough to really know which are good and which might not be as good .

I'm not attacking anyone here just asking a few questions .

Oh and i'm not an admirer or trying to put you down .

Mooch

slows10
11-15-2011, 06:12 PM
I didn't think you were talking about here . I was asking you which site ? Is a secret ? I visit a lot of sites including SPI and was a member when they first started up a few years back .

I have never saw a site knock SPI products but i have seen SPI members knock other products .

Even some members who really haven't painted enough to really know which are good and which might not be as good .

I'm not attacking anyone here just asking a few questions .

Oh and i'm not an admirer or trying to put you down .

Mooch No offense but you strike me as quite the sally sue if I ever saw one. If people on spi forum want to bash other paint products, who really cares its the spi forum. This is not a ppg forum its not even a forum that sells any paint.So the people on here can give any opinion they want on ppg or any other brand. Instead you might just try spi for yourself. I have read on quite a few forums how good the spi clear is and no where have I read it sucks. Seems a bit foolish to spend 300 -400 bucks on a gallon of clear when an spi $120 gallon may be just as good if not better. Seems from what I read from the real pros is that the owner of spi is a stand up guy and has a great product. Not some big corporation who cares less about the actual customer. He does buisness it seems the old fashioned way. Been a lurker hear for quite some time and it seems you are a trouble maker with not much goin on. Again no offense, I just dont understand why the owner of this forum lets silly stuff and comments continue in many of the threads you post in. It just makes this forum look unprofessional and may end up costing this owner potential future sales. This is just my opinion.

another2centsworth
11-15-2011, 06:15 PM
Soooo....100.00 bucks for 2 gal sprayable SPI? really and with free shipping?
I can get 2.5 gal sprayable for 120.00. Sherwin Williams.
And make it look very good.
Might have to give spi a shot but this seems to be a commercial for SPI.
Shopline or omni or whatever isn't crap either.
7900 Chromobase is the easiest thing I have ever sprayed.
I have sprayed most all high end clears with the exception of glasurit.
60 dollar clear on my Honda for 6 yrs now daily driven and never garaged....
That's almost as long as the original clear....imagine that... 8)

slows10
11-15-2011, 06:20 PM
Doesnt sound like a commercial at all. Just the nonsense that follows after the original poster just gave an honest simple opinion.

jeremyb
11-15-2011, 06:38 PM
Man, where do some of you get your numbers. SPI prices are listed right on their website.......

Mooch
11-15-2011, 06:48 PM
No offense but you strike me as quite the sally sue if I ever saw one. If people on spi forum want to bash other paint products, who really cares its the spi forum. This is not a ppg forum its not even a forum that sells any paint.So the people on here can give any opinion they want on ppg or any other brand. Instead you might just try spi for yourself. I have read on quite a few forums how good the spi clear is and no where have I read it sucks. Seems a bit foolish to spend 300 -400 bucks on a gallon of clear when an spi $120 gallon may be just as good if not better. Seems from what I read from the real pros is that the owner of spi is a stand up guy and has a great product. Not some big corporation who cares less about the actual customer. He does buisness it seems the old fashioned way. Been a lurker hear for quite some time and it seems you are a trouble maker with not much goin on. Again no offense, I just dont understand why the owner of this forum lets silly stuff and comments continue in many of the threads you post in. It just makes this forum look unprofessional and may end up costing this owner potential future sales. This is just my opinion.

You can think whatever you want but they have bashed other paint products on this site . You also have not read that SPI sucks here . If you would read what i said you woul see that i have said i have used spi products and said i found them to be good .

So you call me a trouble maker but mean nothing by it . I asked another member a question not you . But you feel the need to come at me .So who is the trouble maker ?

I was around when SPI first started selling to the little guy .I was around when the members of the first SPI forum would invade other forums to push SPI products .
Now I have used several SPI products but have you used any ? I have also talkd to barry a few times and have said in my opinion he is an ok guy .

I haven't knocked any paint product but only wanted to know which forum he had been on where they were bashing SPI . No one asked you to intrude .

Mooch

Mooch
11-15-2011, 07:23 PM
JC Clark

I think you would remember this for me . Didn't SPI have some Base coat paints and some SSU some years back ? I 'm talking about maybe 8 years or so ? I just can't remember ,i do remember the epoxy primer and the clear . The reason i'm asking i don't see a listing anymore .

Thanks Mooch

Mooch
11-15-2011, 09:11 PM
If that's true I wonder why more high-end shops don't use it. I know a lot of shops in this area and nobody I know uses it.

Pretty hard to buy any of it local Len . Mail order service is good but it will take a couple of days .

. And when you need something you aren't going to wait for it .

For the home use guy it is nice to be able to order something over the phone .

It takes a lot of money to be a jobber like you deal with .

Mooch

another2centsworth
11-15-2011, 10:05 PM
Doesnt sound like a commercial at all. Just the nonsense that follows after the original poster just gave an honest simple opinion.
Honestly slow.....read the thread and it could give indications that PPG is no good in comparison. How much experience do you have with different clears? :D

another2centsworth
11-15-2011, 10:17 PM
Man, where do some of you get your numbers. SPI prices are listed right on their website.......

Quote from earlier post...I heard Len talk about Glasurit and like products for $800.00 a gal, I am a long way off from using that and they may be superior however, when it comes to having 2 gallons for under $200.00 and the results are 10 times better than anything else at that price, it is a no brainer.



Now guys, does this look like 2 gallons for under 200 bucks? Sherwin Williams that I spray 2 coats and buffs out great. How many coats you gotta put on for SPI? If I followed those directions from SPI I would be in more than 2 gallons compared to 3 quarts Sherwin Williams. I don't need to flow coat any of my clears. I don't have any thing against any SPI advocates but there are plenty of great priced clears that produce outstanding results. Speaking from personal experience.

Ask bloverby from 101 what he thinks about SPI. It don't buff so great after 2 or 3 months. Another guy with SPI opinions. :redface:

Personally I like to go 10 minutes up the road and buy my clears. 6 days a week. If I'm patient they deliver that day :steering:

jeremyb
11-16-2011, 05:47 AM
Oh really? What clear did he use? I've cut and buffed universal clear 8 months after it was sprayed and it went with ease. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.....and mine is SPI is the best product out there for me and what I do. I've completely switched my primers and clears over to spi, including reducers, adhesion promoter, etc from using sikkens products. Nothing wrong with sikkens, never had a problem with them and the rep is a good friend of mine...I just found SPI to be of the same quality at a more affordable price.

Where do you get that you have to put more than 2 gallons on a car? You don't NEED to flow coat universal clear, and you dont NEED to put more than 2 coats of it on. You don't need to flowcoat any of them. 2 gallons of universal is a little over 200 bucks...the comment of "where do you guys get your numbers" pertained to everyone who are just throwing numbers around.

A jobber carries spi for me, so this mail order mess doesn't apply to me. Most of the time if you can find a jobber within your state they, themselves, will deliver to you through mail.

JCCLARK
11-16-2011, 06:18 AM
JC Clark

I think you would remember this for me . Didn't SPI have some Base coat paints and some SSU some years back ? Thanks Mooch

Of course I remember SPI selling base coats.
And I don't think it was that long ago.
I never used any but seem to remember they were SPI's own colors
which some were a copy of a factory color but SPI had their own
name for them. I heard they were pretty good.
I wish they still carried them, when they quit, a lot of people
were pretty unhappy with not ever being able to get more to match.:(

JCCLARK
11-16-2011, 06:26 AM
These "clear wars" really don't have any kind of ending,
you can buy $800 a gallon clear or $100 a gallon,
there's always going to be a guy that had great results with
either one and bad results too.
I've really never noticed much of a difference, I'm sure the
expensive stuff is inflated a lot for the name but it's good too.
My $80 a gallon clear has won show car paint jobs and
held up just fine on my collision repairs.
Argue who's the best, it's a moot point when a cheap clear on my
car looks and lasts as good.
This arguement will never have a "winner", it's a personal opinion.
If there was a "clear" winner, every shop would be useing the same one:D

JCCLARK
11-16-2011, 06:29 AM
. I don't need to flow coat any of my clears. :steering:

You don't 'have" to flow coat SPI clears either.
I never do. ;)

silentdub
11-16-2011, 09:07 AM
No offense but you strike me as quite the sally sue if I ever saw one. If people on spi forum want to bash other paint products, who really cares its the spi forum. This is not a ppg forum its not even a forum that sells any paint.So the people on here can give any opinion they want on ppg or any other brand. Instead you might just try spi for yourself. I have read on quite a few forums how good the spi clear is and no where have I read it sucks. Seems a bit foolish to spend 300 -400 bucks on a gallon of clear when an spi $120 gallon may be just as good if not better. Seems from what I read from the real pros is that the owner of spi is a stand up guy and has a great product. Not some big corporation who cares less about the actual customer. He does buisness it seems the old fashioned way. Been a lurker hear for quite some time and it seems you are a trouble maker with not much goin on. Again no offense, I just dont understand why the owner of this forum lets silly stuff and comments continue in many of the threads you post in. It just makes this forum look unprofessional and may end up costing this owner potential future sales. This is just my opinion.



I have to admit that the owner 'Barry' is in fact a stand up guy, he has gone out of his way to help me and even gave me his cell # in case I had problems while I was painting, I could call him. That is outstanding service.


I never met the guy, he doesn't give me any special deals and I certainly don't work for him. I boast about products that blow my hair back, if there is a crappy company, I am the first to complain. In this industry, so far, Evercoat and SPI have on more than one occasion blew me away with their service, so why should I not talk about them and give them props. Evercoat did send me a T-Shirt, so maybe you can say I am biased.

I repair and paint some select cars and bikes, most of the people I know don't even have a car for more than 2 or 3 years, but while they have it, it might as well look good.


I do have to also admit that I am working on a 96 Honda Accord, and the clear coat on that from the factory is still standing up even though it was never washed or waxed in 10 years.

I'm not really trying to sway anyone, use what you use, but this stuff just looks good. Again, I'm not doing a 10,000 $ paint job.

silentdub
11-16-2011, 09:28 AM
Quote from earlier post...I heard Len talk about Glasurit and like products for $800.00 a gal, I am a long way off from using that and they may be superior however, when it comes to having 2 gallons for under $200.00 and the results are 10 times better than anything else at that price, it is a no brainer.



Now guys, does this look like 2 gallons for under 200 bucks? Sherwin Williams that I spray 2 coats and buffs out great. How many coats you gotta put on for SPI? If I followed those directions from SPI I would be in more than 2 gallons compared to 3 quarts Sherwin Williams. I don't need to flow coat any of my clears. I don't have any thing against any SPI advocates but there are plenty of great priced clears that produce outstanding results. Speaking from personal experience.

Ask bloverby from 101 what he thinks about SPI. It don't buff so great after 2 or 3 months. Another guy with SPI opinions. :redface:

Personally I like to go 10 minutes up the road and buy my clears. 6 days a week. If I'm patient they deliver that day :steering:



I work full time, by the time I am out of work, the jobbers are long gone. I order SPI and get it the next day, so for me that is fine. I do get my PPG base colors from a local place, but I order my pro-spray as well.

The prices I gave is what I paid. I purchased a gallon kit for I think $204.00, with the universal it was a 1:1 mix so I got 2 spray-able gallons of clear. The pontiac G5 took just under 3/4 of a gallon for an entire outside shoot all coats, this 200x Nissan Maxima took just over 3/4 of a gallon, maybe a little more because I had to do the body kit too.

From my experience, it comes down to about $100/gal give or take. My local jobber (Kayfield) sells PPG Shopline for about the same price, more like $134.00 for a gallon kit, mixed 4:1 you get 1.25 gallons to spray.

I have sprayed both of these several times now and what takes 3/4 of a gallon with SPI would take twice that amount to get the same look and gloss of the PPG.

SPI just seems to be a thicker clear with more body. Play with those numbers all you want, going by quality of the initial look, it's SPI hands down, going by how much material you get dollar for dollar, SPI still takes it.


People say, oh well Shopline is their low grade product, you shouldn't use it blah blah blah. The fact remains, a similar priced product looks better and is clearly a better value than a like priced product.


Len does raise a good point as to how well it holds up over time. I personally don't know, but time will tell. There was one person who used it on a daily driver for 5 years and never washed/waxed it and said it still looks good, so other than having a car for 5 years, that is the best I can go with.


If any of you have used a clear coat system that is similar in price and looks better than SPI, then PLEASE let me know so I can try it. If there is a better product for that same money, I'd drop SPI like a dirty shirt.

Some people buy a Ford just for brand loyalty, I don't.


I am an idiot when it comes with laying paint, I am totally new, but out of the box, I didn't have to buff the SPI or do anything to it. Little to no orange peel to cut with an average grade Devilbliss Plug Gun.

TR3_Nut
11-16-2011, 10:27 AM
You don't 'have" to flow coat SPI clears either.
I never do. ;)

Can you guys explain what it means to "flow coat" a clear? Thanks

Pat

JCCLARK
11-16-2011, 11:47 AM
Can you guys explain what it means to "flow coat" a clear? ThanksPat

It's a way to get away with not buffing and lessening the
urethane wave. There are different ways but basically it's
sanding the clear and reclearing it with a couple reduced coats of clear.
If done right you can get a real slick finish.
Works with other paints too, I don't understand why, but
painting over itself always does better on the second time:)

MARTINSR
11-16-2011, 12:37 PM
JC Clark

I think you would remember this for me . Didn't SPI have some Base coat paints and some SSU some years back ? I 'm talking about maybe 8 years or so ? I just can't remember ,i do remember the epoxy primer and the clear . The reason i'm asking i don't see a listing anymore .

Thanks Mooch


It wasn't that long ago, more like two or three years at the most. It came and went pretty quick. Primers and clears are hard enough to make people happy, throw paint and colors into the mix and you multiply your work and time with customers and tech twenty times I would think.
Brian

Mooch
11-16-2011, 01:12 PM
It wasn't that long ago, more like two or three years at the most. It came and went pretty quick. Primers and clears are hard enough to make people happy, throw paint and colors into the mix and you multiply your work and time with customers and tech twenty times I would think.
Brian

Some here have always said best to stick with base and clear from the same company . Doesn't the fact that so many like SPI clear and use it on any base they choose kind of blow that out of the water ?

Even though cars are out of the picture for me now that my wheels are kind of flat and my joints seem rusty . I am thinking about painting my Bikes so I'm kind of getting interested again .
Never really been a fan of BC/CC for cars " too much bling " but do like it for bikes .

Seemed like a lot longer then 3 years brian .

Mooch

TR3_Nut
11-16-2011, 01:58 PM
It's a way to get away with not buffing and lessening the
urethane wave. There are different ways but basically it's
sanding the clear and reclearing it with a couple reduced coats of clear.
If done right you can get a real slick finish.
Works with other paints too, I don't understand why, but
painting over itself always does better on the second time:)

Thanks JC
That was very helpful. Much appreciated.

another2centsworth
11-16-2011, 03:55 PM
Oh really? What clear did he use? I've cut and buffed universal clear 8 months after it was sprayed and it went with ease. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.....and mine is SPI is the best product out there for me and what I do. I've completely switched my primers and clears over to spi, including reducers, adhesion promoter, etc from using sikkens products. Nothing wrong with sikkens, never had a problem with them and the rep is a good friend of mine...I just found SPI to be of the same quality at a more affordable price.

Where do you get that you have to put more than 2 gallons on a car? You don't NEED to flow coat universal clear, and you dont NEED to put more than 2 coats of it on. You don't need to flowcoat any of them. 2 gallons of universal is a little over 200 bucks...the comment of "where do you guys get your numbers" pertained to everyone who are just throwing numbers around.

A jobber carries spi for me, so this mail order mess doesn't apply to me. Most of the time if you can find a jobber within your state they, themselves, will deliver to you through mail.

I read directions for the perfect SPI paint job a year or two ago.....Not in my preference to flow coat as the site directions clearly show.
Too much film build,time,and materials IMO. This issue some guys take personal of all else is no good in comparison if contradicted. Really ain't a big deal to me.
If there was a jobber around here can't say I wouldn't try it.
I like my local suppliers on primers/base/clear/SS. Jeremy I am not hating on any product....DONE.

another2centsworth
11-16-2011, 03:58 PM
You don't 'have" to flow coat SPI clears either.
I never do. ;)
I understand. But SPI commands it for the perfect paint job on their site....unless it has changed now.
Like the 'clear' winner quote..LOL!

Len
11-16-2011, 04:08 PM
I understand. But SPI commands it for the perfect paint job on their site....unless it has changed now.
Like the 'clear' winner quote..LOL!

It just sells more clear. I've flow coated a couple jobs and found that it didn't improve my finished product, it just added more clear. If I polished the clear I would have ended up with the same finish. Of course this may be because of the products I'm using, with other products adding more clear may help the finish in some way.

jeremyb
11-16-2011, 04:31 PM
It is listed as an "option". That "option" is done quite a bit on high end restos with other products as well, not just spi. It is just preference and another one of those debates on whether or not it makes a difference. No where does it "command it". I personally have done it a few times as well, I can see the difference...even with other clears, not just spi. The extra time and material cost isn't worth it on most jobs though.

For all their clears, it plainly states in the tech sheets, 2 coats to achieve propper mils. They recommend 3 or possibly more for show/custom jobs, just like every other major manufacturer out there...

I never said you were hating on any product, but you should read the text a bit more carefully before you make statements based on what you have read, so they don't turn out to be false. 8)

another2centsworth
11-16-2011, 05:05 PM
It is listed as an "option". That "option" is done quite a bit on high end restos with other products as well, not just spi. It is just preference and another one of those debates on whether or not it makes a difference. No where does it "command it". I personally have done it a few times as well, I can see the difference...even with other clears, not just spi. The extra time and material cost isn't worth it on most jobs though.

For all their clears, it plainly states in the tech sheets, 2 coats to achieve propper mils. They recommend 3 or possibly more for show/custom jobs, just like every other major manufacturer out there...

I never said you were hating on any product, but you should read the text a bit more carefully before you make statements based on what you have read, so they don't turn out to be false. 8)
There is only one perfect...PERIOD. All else is imperfect you SILLY GOOSE! So lighten up. Are you an SPI member? Sounds like it. :?

You said...]For all their clears, it plainly states in the tech sheets, 2 coats to achieve propper mils. They recommend 3 or possibly more for show/custom jobs, just like every other major manufacturer out there...


that is just false to be nice. every other is every other....not everyone says 3 or 4.
practice what you preach puleeze.

jeremyb
11-16-2011, 05:42 PM
There is only one perfect...PERIOD. All else is imperfect you SILLY GOOSE! So lighten up. Are you an SPI member? Sounds like it. :?

You said...]For all their clears, it plainly states in the tech sheets, 2 coats to achieve propper mils. They recommend 3 or possibly more for show/custom jobs, just like every other major manufacturer out there...


that is just false to be nice. every other is every other....not everyone says 3 or 4.
practice what you preach puleeze.

I give.......

Len
11-16-2011, 05:50 PM
I give.......

I can understand applying a flow coat when you spray in a good downdraft booth because you won't have any dust nibs to remove and the final coating will be your finished product but for most hobbyists painting a high-end job in their garage they will need to sand and polish. If they need to sand and polish anyway then flow coating is a waste of time and material. This has nothing to do with SPI it's just a fact of life.

MARTINSR
11-16-2011, 10:41 PM
I can understand applying a flow coat when you spray in a good downdraft booth because you won't have any dust nibs to remove and the final coating will be your finished product but for most hobbyists painting a high-end job in their garage they will need to sand and polish. If they need to sand and polish anyway then flow coating is a waste of time and material. This has nothing to do with SPI it's just a fact of life.

I totally agree with you Len. I always thought of "flow coating" the same I think of using a sealer, its to correct mistakes not to do it "better".

Brian

Mooch
11-16-2011, 11:19 PM
I totally agree with you Len. I always thought of "flow coating" the same I think of using a sealer, its to correct mistakes not to do it "better".

Brian

Just how much thicker is a flow coat of clear ? Does it offer better UV protection for the long term ?

Mooch

Len
11-16-2011, 11:29 PM
Just how much thicker is a flow coat of clear ? Does it offer better UV protection for the long term ?

Mooch

Most of the lower priced clears have most of their UV protection close to the surface so sanding and polishing can remove most of that protection. If the film build is thin AND you sand and polish you can cause the coating to age much more quickly especially in warmer climates where the sun can be more intense.

MARTINSR
11-17-2011, 12:23 AM
Just how much thicker is a flow coat of clear ? Does it offer better UV protection for the long term ?

Mooch

It also depends on how much you sand off, in the end it is likely you have nothing more than you would have if you sanded and polished the clear to begin with.

Brian

Mooch
11-17-2011, 12:28 AM
It also depends on how much you sand off, in the end it is likely you have nothing more than you would have if you sanded and polished the clear to begin with.

Brian

But haven't some of these guys been saying they didn't need to sand ?

Mooch

jeremyb
11-17-2011, 06:02 AM
But haven't some of these guys been saying they didn't need to sand ?

Mooch

IMO, there is no such thing as a high end show quality job that hasn't been sanded and buffed.

I talk to a lot of painters that tell me they sprayed this clear or that clear and it turned out soo great they didn't even need to rub on it. Wouldn't be a big deal if they were talking about drivers and collision work.....but most of them claim to be show car painters/builders. Some of them I've seen and are pretty dang slick out of the gun....but still need that extra mile of sanding and buffing to get it to that next level. BUT, then again everyone has their own interpretation of what a show car is.

JCCLARK
11-17-2011, 06:26 AM
I don't understand why people read "the perfect paint job" on the
SPI site and then think it's instructions on how to use their
products. It's not the way most painters use their products and
the owner will tell you it doesn't need to be done that way.
THAT'S FOR A SHOW CAR FINISH.
Read their tech sheets and see how to use the products.
It's quite different in the instructions.
There is NOT just one way to use their products correctly.

As far as "flow coat" it has its place.
In areas that are hard to access to buff, like door jambs or fire walls,
It's a way to get a buffed looking finish without all the sanding and buffing.
A flow coat also doesn't show scratches later down the road
like most buffed finishes do from future shrinkage.
I have flow coated a few bumpers on high end cars that had a really
good finish, I think it was easier in the long run vs trying
to sand and buff them. Plus it really lessens the wave.
It has its place. But again, it's a personal preference and that
is a arguement that is never resolved.
I know it's hard to keep an open mind on something different.

MARTINSR
11-17-2011, 08:52 AM
But haven't some of these guys been saying they didn't need to sand ?

Mooch

That is the definition of a "flow coat".

Brian

MARTINSR
11-17-2011, 08:53 AM
As far as "flow coat" it has its place.
In areas that are hard to access to buff, like door jambs or fire walls,
It's a way to get a buffed looking finish without all the sanding and buffing.
A flow coat also doesn't show scratches later down the road
like most buffed finishes do from future shrinkage.
I have flow coated a few bumpers on high end cars that had a really
good finish, I think it was easier in the long run vs trying
to sand and buff them. Plus it really lessens the wave.
It has its place. But again, it's a personal preference and that
is a arguement that is never resolved.
I know it's hard to keep an open mind on something different.


I'm with you, there IS a place for the procedure.

Brian

Mooch
11-17-2011, 10:04 AM
I'm with you, there IS a place for the procedure.

Brian

I see plenty of perfect mirror like paint jobs on street rods and admit they really are something .

But not for me . I just don't believe rods were mean't to be a moving mirror . just too damn much bling and plastic look for me .

I prefer the look of that rambler you have brian . But the funny part is i don't mind the bling on a Bike .

My wife might be right when she says I am weird .

I prefer SSU myself for any car or bike .

Mooch

JCCLARK
11-17-2011, 10:12 AM
. I prefer SSU myself for any car or bike . Mooch

that's not uncommon at all:)

Eddie
11-17-2011, 10:42 AM
SPI has several clears, and they are all a little different.

I have always used the Universal Clear. (I purchase base locally at Finish Master.) The UC is very different than the typical refinish clears.

The UC is designed to be very versatile for the custom painter. Example- you can spray a couple of coats, and then airbrush graphics on that, and then bury the graphics with another couple of coats, without delamination or dieback. It's designed that way.

I hammer it on as thick as I can without runs or sags, and that's pretty thick. I also do the flow coat; and do a light cut and buff afterwards, because I'm a dirty garage painter. I've never had dieback or delamination with UC, no matter how thick the finish is.

I've used Kirker SS urethane for "quickie" low end jobs and on small parts. It is cheap and thin. You have to spray it very precisely (not too thick) or you will get dieback, guaranteed. I have learned how to get very good results from this product; one "tack coat" and two medium-wet coats. No more, no less, no room for error.

What professional refinishers do is very different from what home paint job and custom painters do.

JCCLARK
11-17-2011, 12:08 PM
What professional refinishers do is very different from what home paint job and custom painters do.

That is a very good point.
And that is why some clears workl better for some than others.
SPI is formulated for the backyard painter, it has to do with
the tail solvents and flashing characteristics.
Example,
SPI recommends turning exhaust fans off as soon as possible
after spraying, other clears that are designed for spray booths
may say otherwise. There are differences, maybe small,
but they do make a difference.
It just depends on the market the clear is targeting.
I don't understand all the differences I've heard about, but
Barry (the owner) at SPI is happy to explain it to anyone.
I'll give him the benifit of the doubt-he knows paint.
I use his products, but I use others too.
I'm not loyal to his or any other brand like some are.
I like to support my local guy & I like his products too.
And I also use Kirker paints.:D

Mooch
11-17-2011, 03:23 PM
I intend to use SPI UC when i get around to doing my Harley . But and i know i'm opening up a can of worrms but has anyone used AutoAir products on any bike parts ?


Mooch

ding
11-17-2011, 03:47 PM
I intend to use SPI UC when i get around to doing my Harley . But and i know i'm opening up a can of worrms but has anyone used AutoAir products on any bike parts ?


Mooch

Seen airbrushers use it for art work. Never have personally used it. Its a waterbased product not a waterborne product (whatever that means ;) ) For what it's worth, there are better choices, but it might be fun to play with.

silentdub
01-11-2012, 01:30 PM
This is my 1st 3 stage paint here on this honda accord

I used the PPG Shopline base, same color over existing oem base.

1 gram of electric blue pearl per 32oz of clear (paintwithpearl.com)

2 coats of SPI UClear.


The pictures don't do the job justice, I need to get someone to take a good picture for me.

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